Comments on: I.M. Broke, Ph.D.

By: Michael A. Horvath

Michael A. Horvath — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 18:23:54 +0000

Could there be snother reason, like the longer the exposure to education, the less the value of the product?

In the search for truth, we would not have those like the “clkimatologists” whoise only concern is how to generate additional grants,, than to search for the truth.

At a UNESCO conference, in which I participated, the academicians from leading Europe universities from Italy and Germany presented papers on how to get grants, rather than on how to seek truth.

They were chastised and at least acknowledged that this criticism was justified.

My experience with students and faculty from mon-western universities is that most non-western institutions of higher learning they are not yet totally tainted with the western universities detour from the search from the truth.

By: CAA

CAA — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 16:53:25 +0000

The situation is bad for some portions of the scientific community as well. The number of tenure track jobs has steadily decreased relative to the number of applicants. Though my phd is in bioengineering, I work in neuroscience, at a major school, and every lab at the center I work at has a glut of phds, and post-docs, hoping for a job.

Couple this with the extreme difficulty of getting funding for your research, and the situation cannot be sustained. The supply is too great.

It’s a little depressing, and when given the chance, I counsel most people to think twice before they pursue a phd, at least if they want to go into academia. If they want to do something technology oriented, then there are many opportunities, if you pick the right field – say electrical or computer engineering. Though even then, from my experience at Berkeley, the majority of folks in these fields are foreign, and not American.

In the end, you wonder what’s the point, if after 5-7 years of graduate work, then a post-doc, and then there’s only a moderate, at best, chance of finding an academic position. This is perhaps the worst part – this mentality leads pretty fast to dejection.

As for a prediction, if Nature and Science articles on careers are a guide, then more people will opt out of this cycle. The exodus is already being documented, and should steadily increase.

By: Susan Karina, OP

Susan Karina, OP — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 14:08:51 +0000

Two thoughts: 1) Perhaps the number of PhD’s is adjusting to demand. When I recevied the PhD in history in 1993 there were already some 5,000 unemployed or underemployed people with that degree. The country just didn’t need that many historians. 2) While it is discouraging that real earnings have dropped, I suspect that for many who earn doctorates in the humanities, money is not the primary motivator. Making a contribution to your field of study, the hope of working in an intellectually stimulating environment, and even sharing the love of learning drive many of us to pursue degrees that offer relatively little in the way of income compared to master and professional degrees in business and specialized fields.
Mandel’s concerns about innovation and the future are worth exploring. Where is the next generation of deep thinkers going to come from? And to what degree is financial reward necessary to replenish the ranks of the knowledge class, especially its elites?

By: john Schroeder

john Schroeder — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 14:00:34 +0000

I find this unsurprising. First there is the debt accumulated to obtain those degrees. Secondly, the theses produced in all fields but science are so esoteric in nature that they have no practical or innovative use.

Even when I went to grad school and dinosaurs roamed the earth, and in science, it was apparent that I could get my masters while working and make the same or more by the time I got to the point where I would be finishing a phd. Better lifestyle during those years – the same after assuming an average level of business accomplishment.

Pursuit of a phd often retards the development of the people and leadership skills necessary for success in business which limits the earning potential of graduates.

But even with all that these stats would be far more interesting if the degrees were broken down by field. I do not think the trend would be so pronounce in the sciences versus the humanities.

By: Michael Liccione

Michael Liccione — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 13:32:38 +0000

I was at the American Philosophical Association’s Eastern Division convention in New York the week after Christmas. The interviewers and interviewees all said the job market was the worst they’d ever seen. Well, we were all moaning about the wretched market when I was getting my PhD in the 1980s. I left the field 15 years ago, and it appears nothing has changed.

I’ve long thought the problem is for humanities PhDs, not those in the sciences, business, or law. The former have few alternatives outside academia; the latter have many. It’s all a matter of supply and demand.