The catholic church whose german born pope continues to demonize gay people, and in 2009 Unexcommunicated a bishop williamson, who is a holocaust denier. Talk about a church losing its way.

And the people who adhere, regardless of where they are living, to the old culture of the south, which gave us slavery, the KKK, and segregation.

These evil people are murderers beyond comprehension. Of course they get others to do their dirty work.

In the aftermath of WWII, there were actually many Nuremberg trials. Not of the people who threw the Jews, gays, and other despised by the nazis groups into the ovens.

But of those whose words created and supported the climate of fear, hatred and utter evil that gave us WWII and the holocaust of 6 million Jews and 5 million others.

And the fact that they didn’t pull the trigger or toss the victims into the ovens was no defense.

When are we going to re-instate the Nuremberg trials for the evil ones who poison our society resulting in this continuing 9/11 every single year.

And hitler was of course the leader who didnt have the guts to face justice and committed suicide as the Russians were knocking on the doors of his bunker in Berlin.

If captured he didn’t deserve a hanging. He deserved to be put on display naked in a zoo. Where for perhaps a couple decades people could come and stone him, in continual torture, until at the end he would have been tossed to the lions for a meal.

YOu cant blame lions for eating people, its what they are from their birth.

For hitler to be fed to them on worldwide TV would be a message for the next 10000 years about people who mass murder people.

And remember – to this very day, hitler has yet to be EXcommunicated by his church.

The church that gave the world the hatred of Jesus own people the Jews, Which hitler leveraged to gain election and 55 million died.

And why hasn’t the church excommunicated him?

Because to do so they would have had to excommunciate the church for their part in poisoning so many against jesus own people, which brought him to power

It is, as some commentators mentioned, time to separate civil marriage and religious marriage.

Let the churches define whom they want to marry, which is their right. But insure that as in France etc, these marriages do not confer any legal /contractual rights.

Separately all people, regardless of sexuality, color, etc should be allowed to marry under civil law, with the only restrictions being age, not too close a relationship, and no coercion .
Simlpy go to the civil authorities and sign the legal contract of marriage and get your “rights”.

Go to your church, and if the church approves, get your “marriage rites”.

First there is absolutely no requirement for a couple to plan to have, or even be able to have children. The days of the tribe needing more and more children to fight the incessant wars against other tribes and survive in the face fo 80% infant death rates are gone.

Second we should be aware that about 25% of gay children find out what christian love really means when their parents throw them out of their house the day they are 18.

Next – AS someone else mentioned, “if you know a gay person, you will discover in all likelyhood they are wonderful people”

Thats true. The closet is just a version of the ghetto, which hitler used to hide the Jews from the population at large. Then it was so easy to demonize them, and get the people cheering at his “final solutioN”

I know many many gay people. Virtually all of them are great people, though the majority of them have left religion because conservative religion demonizes them.

And almost all of them have been suicidal in their youth, and most know some other gay who committed suicide. All of course due to the incessant hatred of gays that poisons our societies.

What do you think Jesus would do. or where will HE send the leaders of the churches that are so hollow they always need someone to hate to sell their “love”

Perhaps the wind whistling in the trees is the Sound of God’s expanding Hell to accomodate the “anything but Christians”, who use God and Jesus name to perpetuate hatred of minorities.

Not just gays, but Jews (Jesus own people), orientals, blacks and every other minority group.

Which is the reason we should never never never let majorities determine the rights of minorities. As we did in the south in the past.

It is, as some commentators mentioned, time to separate civil marriage and religious marriage.

Let the churches define whom they want to marry, which is their right. But insure that as in France etc, these marriages do not confer any legal /contractual rights.

Separately all people, regardless of sexuality, color, etc should be allowed to marry under civil law, with the only restrictions being age, not too close a relationship, and no coercion .
Simlpy go to the civil authorities and sign the legal contract of marriage and get your “rights”.

Go to your church, and if the church approves, get your “marriage rites”.

Justifying slaver as per the bible, and giving the USA the KKK and segregation. This hatred is being rekindled in the USA by the bible belt branch of the republican party.

Hating gay people and driving 3000 gay teens to suicide every year – a 9/11 of our children in the name of a hateful interpretation of God EVERY SINGLE YEAR . We are fighting the wrong war on terrorism.

A pope who learned his lessons well growing up in Nazi germany. In 2009 he UNexcommunciated a Bishop Williamson, formerly with the Anglican church.
Williamson is a holocaust denier.

The catholic church has yet to excommunciate the worst murderer of modern times, Hitler. But it has instantly excommunicated good priests who supported marriage equality for gay people.

All over the world, wherever the church operates, we find the Cath church has hidden endless child abuse. Brazil, the USA, Ireland, england, Switzerland etc. Virtually all western
nations.

How did hitler get elected? On the backs of the hatred of the Jews, which his church fomented for a 1000 years because the Jews wouldn’t convert

The catholic church burned at the stake perhaps a million women as witches during the middle ages. Why – because they saw “witchcraft” as a competing religion. And also to buttress the power of men over women. Identical to what we see today in Islam.

The list of crimes in the name of Jesus must make Him turn over in his grave.

And re gay marriage or equivalent, Today Ireland, the country that evangelized catholicism in Europe granted gays fulll marrige rights (not rites) under the term civil unions. Could this be due to the endless physical, mental and sexual abuse of children by the catholic “christian brothers” in Ireland. Which runs reform schools. They used children as slaves in factories building relgiious trinkets, fed them poorly etc. And a good day was a day without a beating.

over the world today every last western european nation except italy and greece give gays marriage or an equivalent legal construct.

Add CAnada, and 6 countries in latin america. Sick and tired of the evil perpetuated in the name of God by conservative churches.

Parts of the USA, 3 countries in E. Europe, Israel, RSA, Nepal, AU and NZ

And in Europe, Finland is leading the change from “partnerships to marriage for gay people. Denmark – most conservative of the scandanavian countries just gave gays the right to adopt. Endland is close to doing as finland did, France may follow.

As I said before – teh conservative churches have the right to commit suicide. Given their past and present history, the only shame is they didn’t do so long long ago.

And free the people from their dogma. If Jesus came back today, they would no longer be able to use his name.

The christian conservativer churches have the right to commit suicide. They will be unwept, dishonored and unsung.

While the good christian churches like the UCC, Episcopal, MCC, some presbyterian branches, Evangelical Lutherans, American Baptists, jewish reform and some Jewish conservative continue to treak our gay friends as part of Gods wondrous creation, entitled to equal treatment under the law.

Mr. Koehl, please contribute something substantive to the discussion, or be silent. Even a relevant question would do.

As for your question, Mr. Koehl, I’d advise you to pose it as follows on the later thread, where your peculiar fixation has already been criticized:

Although I know its relevance to the SSM issue has been called into doubt, might anyone be willing to answer my question, or point me in the right direction here? Please–I mean, if you don’t think this would distract too much from the present discussion, I’d really appreciate it.

I suggest that you study the critical remarks about “definition fixation” that have been made in the more recent thread. Here we’ve been discussing the wrongful harms that are frequently committed by religious conservatives in an arguably misguided (and often hypocritical) attempt to protect “family values.” This is one reason that some of the French may be well-advised in distancing themselves from certain norms associated marriage. The upshot, of course, is that those traditionalist norms associated with marriage are harmful to families and to the public’s willingness to respect the institution of marriage, as witnessed in France.

It’s become obvious that you are upset. Passions have made more productive dialog difficult. Because it’s an emotional issue for a lot of people, I’m willing to give you a pass. In the future, however, please try to avoid taking my critical remarks about your blog behavior as mere “put-downs.” My critical remarks are my attempts to help you to distinguish your comments of late from substantive comments that would be relevant to the present discussion.

That you are an un-serious person who thinks a put down is an argument. So, answer the question I posed elsewhere: has there ever been a society, in any place, at any time, that conceived of marriage as involving the legal union of two people of the same sex?

Failure to answer with an affirmative example would be a tacit admission that what you truly seek is a complete redefinition of marriage contrary to what has universally been understood by the term. That, in turn, places the burden of proof upon you: just why should we do this, and to whose benefit?