<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The World&#8217;s Most Expensive Photograph is Very Orange and Slightly Overpriced</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/</link>
	<description>A First Things Blog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 18 May 2013 04:22:18 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michael Cerulli Billingsley</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41675</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Cerulli Billingsley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2011 07:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41675</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sort of late in the game here, but I was curious that of the comments where &quot;the woman&quot; photographed is discussed, no one seems to get that the model is Sherman... or that she has consistently been that (the model for her own photographs).

Being orange in this case, or a &quot;tart,&quot; or pin-up, or a cheerleader, or a waitress, or a seemingly abandoned woman in a cheerless bar - are all set ups contrived by Sherman to explore the way we read &quot;into&quot; who SHE is, on the basis of what&#039;s limited to the information constructed within her frame.  My guess is that she works it pretty hard... from the inside as well... to match the projection she&#039;s mimicking for the camera.

So I suppose y&#039;all can go to town on pythagorean proportions and such, but my guess is that she&#039;s jerking you around a little... and you&#039;ve swallowed the bait.  If one extremely devoted sucker wants to be drowned in his or her projections to the tune of $3.4 million or so - I&#039;d personally prefer he (or she) to drop those bucks in Haiti... and not with those folks rebuilding their resort condos.  

But the critique of this particular photo also seems to fall curiously often into the &quot;So - is photography ART?&quot; genre of geez, that much for a PHOTO!!!!  Come on people.   You&#039;re talking about art on the marketplace here... driven by market factors.  I don&#039;t understand them - why pretend to?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sort of late in the game here, but I was curious that of the comments where &#8220;the woman&#8221; photographed is discussed, no one seems to get that the model is Sherman&#8230; or that she has consistently been that (the model for her own photographs).</p>
<p>Being orange in this case, or a &#8220;tart,&#8221; or pin-up, or a cheerleader, or a waitress, or a seemingly abandoned woman in a cheerless bar &#8211; are all set ups contrived by Sherman to explore the way we read &#8220;into&#8221; who SHE is, on the basis of what&#8217;s limited to the information constructed within her frame.  My guess is that she works it pretty hard&#8230; from the inside as well&#8230; to match the projection she&#8217;s mimicking for the camera.</p>
<p>So I suppose y&#8217;all can go to town on pythagorean proportions and such, but my guess is that she&#8217;s jerking you around a little&#8230; and you&#8217;ve swallowed the bait.  If one extremely devoted sucker wants to be drowned in his or her projections to the tune of $3.4 million or so &#8211; I&#8217;d personally prefer he (or she) to drop those bucks in Haiti&#8230; and not with those folks rebuilding their resort condos.  </p>
<p>But the critique of this particular photo also seems to fall curiously often into the &#8220;So &#8211; is photography ART?&#8221; genre of geez, that much for a PHOTO!!!!  Come on people.   You&#8217;re talking about art on the marketplace here&#8230; driven by market factors.  I don&#8217;t understand them &#8211; why pretend to?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michael PS</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41173</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael PS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 May 2011 09:52:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41173</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[On the role of mathematics in art, it is worth remembering that the treatises on perspective by Alberti, Leonardo, Piero della Francesca and Durer (embodying the insights of Brunelleschi and his school) inspired Desargues and Le Hire to develop Projective Geometry, which, in turn, inspired the Analytical Geometry of Descartes and Fermat. 

It is no coincidence that Brunelleschi was a notable architect and civil engineer.

Or, in another medium, consider Pythagoras&#039;s work on harmonics]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the role of mathematics in art, it is worth remembering that the treatises on perspective by Alberti, Leonardo, Piero della Francesca and Durer (embodying the insights of Brunelleschi and his school) inspired Desargues and Le Hire to develop Projective Geometry, which, in turn, inspired the Analytical Geometry of Descartes and Fermat. </p>
<p>It is no coincidence that Brunelleschi was a notable architect and civil engineer.</p>
<p>Or, in another medium, consider Pythagoras&#8217;s work on harmonics</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Most Expensive Photograph is all about Orange</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41095</link>
		<dc:creator>Most Expensive Photograph is all about Orange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 May 2011 11:29:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41095</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] However experts such as the one who first reported about this photo disagree. Read up on First Things for more details, especially if you believe you have a photographers eye.     But if you believe [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] However experts such as the one who first reported about this photo disagree. Read up on First Things for more details, especially if you believe you have a photographers eye.     But if you believe [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: miliukov</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41085</link>
		<dc:creator>miliukov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 May 2011 08:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41085</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I recently sold some photos to a collector for display in her personal office.  She chose around a dozen out of maybe 200 that I showed her, and paid me more for them than I could have possibly imagined.

I thought the ones she chose ranged from decent at best to downright dreadful -- and they certainly wouldn&#039;t have met the &quot;rule of thirds&quot;!  On top of that, a couple were technically challenged, to put it charitably.

But when she finally set about to arrange the final prints, I realized that she had found some commonalities between sets of 2-3 photos that brought out elements even I, nominally the photographer, hadn&#039;t seen -- probably because I could only see them in the context I had originally snapped them, whereas the collector saw them in the context of imperfect photos grouped according to some themes that only came out when you placed them side by side, but otherwise isolated.  

Were my photographs &quot;art&quot;?  Certainly not.  But nevertheless she found something that spoke to her in them, and felt compelled enough to buy them.  No accounting for taste.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recently sold some photos to a collector for display in her personal office.  She chose around a dozen out of maybe 200 that I showed her, and paid me more for them than I could have possibly imagined.</p>
<p>I thought the ones she chose ranged from decent at best to downright dreadful &#8212; and they certainly wouldn&#8217;t have met the &#8220;rule of thirds&#8221;!  On top of that, a couple were technically challenged, to put it charitably.</p>
<p>But when she finally set about to arrange the final prints, I realized that she had found some commonalities between sets of 2-3 photos that brought out elements even I, nominally the photographer, hadn&#8217;t seen &#8212; probably because I could only see them in the context I had originally snapped them, whereas the collector saw them in the context of imperfect photos grouped according to some themes that only came out when you placed them side by side, but otherwise isolated.  </p>
<p>Were my photographs &#8220;art&#8221;?  Certainly not.  But nevertheless she found something that spoke to her in them, and felt compelled enough to buy them.  No accounting for taste.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: T.B.Root</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41035</link>
		<dc:creator>T.B.Root</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 21:56:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41035</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree, S.J. Craft is very important and artists should be masters of it. But Joe is more confident in his technical prescriptions than were the excellent artists with whom I studied. 

And there&#039;s this caution: Frustrated lesser talents in the arts will often turn for relief to a quantifiable technical aspect of art at which they can excel. They become expert in a small corner--be it color and design or anatomy or materials, etc.--and then insist that it&#039;s the whole game. As teachers, their natural enemy is the truly gifted. None of this raises art.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, S.J. Craft is very important and artists should be masters of it. But Joe is more confident in his technical prescriptions than were the excellent artists with whom I studied. </p>
<p>And there&#8217;s this caution: Frustrated lesser talents in the arts will often turn for relief to a quantifiable technical aspect of art at which they can excel. They become expert in a small corner&#8211;be it color and design or anatomy or materials, etc.&#8211;and then insist that it&#8217;s the whole game. As teachers, their natural enemy is the truly gifted. None of this raises art.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: S.L. Hersey</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41027</link>
		<dc:creator>S.L. Hersey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 20:04:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41027</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That&#039;s fair enough, Mr. (?) Root.  Such principles can certainly be taken to self-destructive extremes.  Still, even if that&#039;s exactly what Carter&#039;s saying, it&#039;s far closer to the truth than contemporary art theory would have it.  I&#039;d replace &quot;any and all&quot; with &quot;most.&quot;

But even if such prescriptivism is a total mistake, it seems like the last vice that contemporary art is in danger of lapsing into.  In fact, much of what&#039;s wrong with current efforts stems from an inordinate aversion to it.  At this point, even a little erring in Carter&#039;s direction would be more salutary than our reflexive erring away from it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s fair enough, Mr. (?) Root.  Such principles can certainly be taken to self-destructive extremes.  Still, even if that&#8217;s exactly what Carter&#8217;s saying, it&#8217;s far closer to the truth than contemporary art theory would have it.  I&#8217;d replace &#8220;any and all&#8221; with &#8220;most.&#8221;</p>
<p>But even if such prescriptivism is a total mistake, it seems like the last vice that contemporary art is in danger of lapsing into.  In fact, much of what&#8217;s wrong with current efforts stems from an inordinate aversion to it.  At this point, even a little erring in Carter&#8217;s direction would be more salutary than our reflexive erring away from it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: T.B.Root</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-41022</link>
		<dc:creator>T.B.Root</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 19:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-41022</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m not saying all that, S.J.Hersey. I&#039;m just trying to say that Joe goes too far by saying (or seeming to say) that certain simple design principles are essential to the success of any and all art work and that fidelity to those can be perceived at any size reproduction. I mean, that&#039;s true, except for all the times when it isn&#039;t. 

I&#039;m not really defending Cindy Sherman, you know. I&#039;ll take Joel Sternfeld instead. Or William Eggleston.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not saying all that, S.J.Hersey. I&#8217;m just trying to say that Joe goes too far by saying (or seeming to say) that certain simple design principles are essential to the success of any and all art work and that fidelity to those can be perceived at any size reproduction. I mean, that&#8217;s true, except for all the times when it isn&#8217;t. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not really defending Cindy Sherman, you know. I&#8217;ll take Joel Sternfeld instead. Or William Eggleston.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: S.L. Hersey</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-40996</link>
		<dc:creator>S.L. Hersey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 17:15:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-40996</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think your scruples do you credit, T.B., but you&#039;re on the verge of destroying your argument&#039;s validity by making it unfalsifiable--absolutely any piece of dreck I can post on-line JUST MIGHT prove to be a solid work of art when seen in its original form, taken in a special context, or sifted for some compositional oddity that for all anyone knows, could&#039;ve been intentional.

The sort of &quot;grids&quot; and &quot;shop rules&quot; that Joe Carter is citing are not sufficient to objectively qualify something as art, but are arguably necessary.  Are compositional rules set in stone?  No.  Can they be broken?  Sure they can, but not many can get away with it.  Unless you&#039;re a Durer, Turner, or Caravaggio, you&#039;re less likely to produce &quot;strong effects&quot; than &quot;poop on a canvas.&quot;

And even by the most generous estimates, Cindy Sherman is no Durer/Turner/etc.  Her foregoing of craftsmanship (even if deliberate, which I don&#039;t buy) has earned no comparable benefit of the doubt.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think your scruples do you credit, T.B., but you&#8217;re on the verge of destroying your argument&#8217;s validity by making it unfalsifiable&#8211;absolutely any piece of dreck I can post on-line JUST MIGHT prove to be a solid work of art when seen in its original form, taken in a special context, or sifted for some compositional oddity that for all anyone knows, could&#8217;ve been intentional.</p>
<p>The sort of &#8220;grids&#8221; and &#8220;shop rules&#8221; that Joe Carter is citing are not sufficient to objectively qualify something as art, but are arguably necessary.  Are compositional rules set in stone?  No.  Can they be broken?  Sure they can, but not many can get away with it.  Unless you&#8217;re a Durer, Turner, or Caravaggio, you&#8217;re less likely to produce &#8220;strong effects&#8221; than &#8220;poop on a canvas.&#8221;</p>
<p>And even by the most generous estimates, Cindy Sherman is no Durer/Turner/etc.  Her foregoing of craftsmanship (even if deliberate, which I don&#8217;t buy) has earned no comparable benefit of the doubt.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: T.B.Root</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-40979</link>
		<dc:creator>T.B.Root</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 16:12:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-40979</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have seen plenty of art work that looked pretty good as a slide, but terrible in person.
And I have seen plenty of good work that did not reproduce well.

There are many compositional rules that can be helpful to an artist: the rule against equal measures of light and dark, the rule against multiple points of equal interest, the rule against tangents of outline, the rule against repetition of equal intervals of space, etc. Such mistakes are like standing up in a canoe--they produce strong effects that can lead to disaster.

But a competent artist can use these strong effects to good purpose, and minimize the problems by shifts of emphasis. Many a great picture would not conform to these guidelines. So you can&#039;t just throw a grid over a work of art to judge it. These are shop rules for artists, not judging criteria for critics. 

It seems to me that the point of Cindy Sherman&#039;s photo is precisely that weird sideways blurry ill-composed look to it. It&#039;s a kind of anti-compositional anti-art. To throw it into a more balanced scheme would be to rob it of its intended qualities.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have seen plenty of art work that looked pretty good as a slide, but terrible in person.<br />
And I have seen plenty of good work that did not reproduce well.</p>
<p>There are many compositional rules that can be helpful to an artist: the rule against equal measures of light and dark, the rule against multiple points of equal interest, the rule against tangents of outline, the rule against repetition of equal intervals of space, etc. Such mistakes are like standing up in a canoe&#8211;they produce strong effects that can lead to disaster.</p>
<p>But a competent artist can use these strong effects to good purpose, and minimize the problems by shifts of emphasis. Many a great picture would not conform to these guidelines. So you can&#8217;t just throw a grid over a work of art to judge it. These are shop rules for artists, not judging criteria for critics. </p>
<p>It seems to me that the point of Cindy Sherman&#8217;s photo is precisely that weird sideways blurry ill-composed look to it. It&#8217;s a kind of anti-compositional anti-art. To throw it into a more balanced scheme would be to rob it of its intended qualities.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JAM</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2011/05/19/the-worlds-most-expensive-photograph-is-very-orange-and-slightly-overpriced/comment-page-1/#comment-40972</link>
		<dc:creator>JAM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2011 15:33:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=30146#comment-40972</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry, but anyone who would pay that kind of money for a photograph of anything or anyone -except maybe a verified photograph of Jesus Christ - is out of his freaking mind.

JAM]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, but anyone who would pay that kind of money for a photograph of anything or anyone -except maybe a verified photograph of Jesus Christ &#8211; is out of his freaking mind.</p>
<p>JAM</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
