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	<title>Comments on: Clerical Fashions</title>
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	<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/</link>
	<description>A First Things Blog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 16:45:07 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: jb</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-88220</link>
		<dc:creator>jb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Jan 2013 07:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-88220</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[See this link -

badvestments.blogspot.com

Hilarious!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See this link -</p>
<p>badvestments.blogspot.com</p>
<p>Hilarious!</p>
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		<title>By: peg</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-88005</link>
		<dc:creator>peg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:02:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-88005</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I recall a Britisher (James Lee-Milne?) commenting that the vestments of women clerics too often reminded him of Pius X at his coronation.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recall a Britisher (James Lee-Milne?) commenting that the vestments of women clerics too often reminded him of Pius X at his coronation.</p>
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		<title>By: AnneG</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-88004</link>
		<dc:creator>AnneG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:56:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-88004</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I embroider and make vestments. The one in the picture should be called &quot;Angry Birds&quot; chasuble. Really? That is supposed to teach the reality of the Resurrection of Christ? 
Vestments are supposed to instruct: we are worshipping God in a certain liturgical time that reminds us to reflect on a portion of the Life of Jesus; they are supposed to cloak the priest in particular garments suitable for the worship of God and remove the person of the priest who acts in Locum Christi in worship. The vestments also reflect our heritage from Jewish Temple worship. The other stuff on the site is worse. Blech! We should use our best for the worship of God. These belong back with the felt banners of the &#039;80&#039;s. expensive, not fine materials, too cutesy. Btw there are some very fine vestments made from the 18th to late 19th centuries with fine workmanship and quality materials still in use for special occasions. Better use of resources.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I embroider and make vestments. The one in the picture should be called &#8220;Angry Birds&#8221; chasuble. Really? That is supposed to teach the reality of the Resurrection of Christ?<br />
Vestments are supposed to instruct: we are worshipping God in a certain liturgical time that reminds us to reflect on a portion of the Life of Jesus; they are supposed to cloak the priest in particular garments suitable for the worship of God and remove the person of the priest who acts in Locum Christi in worship. The vestments also reflect our heritage from Jewish Temple worship. The other stuff on the site is worse. Blech! We should use our best for the worship of God. These belong back with the felt banners of the &#8217;80&#8242;s. expensive, not fine materials, too cutesy. Btw there are some very fine vestments made from the 18th to late 19th centuries with fine workmanship and quality materials still in use for special occasions. Better use of resources.</p>
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		<title>By: Deborah</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-88001</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:37:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-88001</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Well, what else do you expect when you have female clergy?&quot; was my flippant reaction to first reading this.  I&#039;ve loved fashion since I was a little girl, however, so I had to see more.  The gold chasuble worn by Reformed minister looks neither outlandish nor silly (unlike the one with the Easter eggs), but isn&#039;t it ironic for a Protestant clergyman to be draped in Swarovski crystals while the Catholic Church is still routinely bashed for its worldly extravagance?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Well, what else do you expect when you have female clergy?&#8221; was my flippant reaction to first reading this.  I&#8217;ve loved fashion since I was a little girl, however, so I had to see more.  The gold chasuble worn by Reformed minister looks neither outlandish nor silly (unlike the one with the Easter eggs), but isn&#8217;t it ironic for a Protestant clergyman to be draped in Swarovski crystals while the Catholic Church is still routinely bashed for its worldly extravagance?</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Homan</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-88000</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Homan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:30:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-88000</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree with ChrisZ, especially the point about traditional vestments.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with ChrisZ, especially the point about traditional vestments.</p>
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		<title>By: David Nickol</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-87999</link>
		<dc:creator>David Nickol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:28:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-87999</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It looks a bit too much like greeting-card art to me, but a lot of people gushed over Cardinal Burke&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://wdtprs.com/blog/2011/07/what-a-cardinals-cappa-magna-looks-like-in-the-wild/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;cappa magna,&lt;/a&gt; while others found it hilarious.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It looks a bit too much like greeting-card art to me, but a lot of people gushed over Cardinal Burke&#8217;s <a href="http://wdtprs.com/blog/2011/07/what-a-cardinals-cappa-magna-looks-like-in-the-wild/" rel="nofollow">cappa magna,</a> while others found it hilarious.</p>
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		<title>By: ChrisZ</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-87996</link>
		<dc:creator>ChrisZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:25:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-87996</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[About the &quot;dancing Easter eggs&quot; vestment, which you cavalierly dismiss: granted, there&#039;s a children&#039;s book quality to it, which lacks gravity--although as children&#039;s book illustrations go it&#039;s artistically and stylishly done (reminds me of the lovely work of the Provensens). But look at those eggs again.

The yellowish one at right is also meant to convey the rolled-away stone at the tomb of Christ; the white oval behind it is the entrance to the tomb, flooded with light, with rays charging forth to illuminate and nourish the world. And the whole comlex of images is centered over the priest&#039;s heart--as if that&#039;s the empty place that needs to be filled with our Lord&#039;s light, so it can radiate that light to the world.

Okay, maybe that takes us from storybooks to Iron Man. But there&#039;s SOMETHING about that image that WORKS: a thought behind it, a spiritual insight; and I&#039;d like to see more of it. Needless to say, in order to refine that image it&#039;s going to take some artistic misses before a hit emerges. But genuine devotional artists deserve the freedom to make a misfire, in the hope that it will direct them to true (or truthful) art.

Rotely denigrating their efforts is a sure way to keep ecclesiastical art impoverished and dull, the way it certainly is now--to the utter scandal of churches that once exalted the arts to their highest expressions.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>About the &#8220;dancing Easter eggs&#8221; vestment, which you cavalierly dismiss: granted, there&#8217;s a children&#8217;s book quality to it, which lacks gravity&#8211;although as children&#8217;s book illustrations go it&#8217;s artistically and stylishly done (reminds me of the lovely work of the Provensens). But look at those eggs again.</p>
<p>The yellowish one at right is also meant to convey the rolled-away stone at the tomb of Christ; the white oval behind it is the entrance to the tomb, flooded with light, with rays charging forth to illuminate and nourish the world. And the whole comlex of images is centered over the priest&#8217;s heart&#8211;as if that&#8217;s the empty place that needs to be filled with our Lord&#8217;s light, so it can radiate that light to the world.</p>
<p>Okay, maybe that takes us from storybooks to Iron Man. But there&#8217;s SOMETHING about that image that WORKS: a thought behind it, a spiritual insight; and I&#8217;d like to see more of it. Needless to say, in order to refine that image it&#8217;s going to take some artistic misses before a hit emerges. But genuine devotional artists deserve the freedom to make a misfire, in the hope that it will direct them to true (or truthful) art.</p>
<p>Rotely denigrating their efforts is a sure way to keep ecclesiastical art impoverished and dull, the way it certainly is now&#8211;to the utter scandal of churches that once exalted the arts to their highest expressions.</p>
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		<title>By: ChrisZ</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-87988</link>
		<dc:creator>ChrisZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:00:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-87988</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[David, maybe it&#039;s TOO easy a target. At least these designers seem to feel that liturgy should be a time and place for artistic creativity to prevail, for color and design and pattern and texture to be elements that help awaken us to the greater mysteries of God. That&#039;s always been the point, has it not, of the vestments, the music, the elevated language and edifying architectural environment that have been associated with liturgy.

But there&#039;s nothing intrinsically sacred, let alone salvific, about the 6th-century fancy dress that comprise the inherited vestment style of the traditional churches. Once, long ago, they really made an impression on the worshipper: imagine what it must have been like to be a medieval peasant--with an experience of clothing, fabric, and design that was completely utilitarian--who sees a priest in his shimmering vestments, feels the rich weaving of the fabric as the celebrant passes in procession.

We today, who have riches and design all around us, really can&#039;t get that same feeling--and maybe we&#039;re missing part of the total liturgical experience thereby. I get it that the vestments on display are not to your taste. But I don&#039;t think they&#039;re laughable or undignified. And at least they&#039;re trying to apply art and craft, in a reverent way, to liturgy, with a view to edifying the worshipper.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David, maybe it&#8217;s TOO easy a target. At least these designers seem to feel that liturgy should be a time and place for artistic creativity to prevail, for color and design and pattern and texture to be elements that help awaken us to the greater mysteries of God. That&#8217;s always been the point, has it not, of the vestments, the music, the elevated language and edifying architectural environment that have been associated with liturgy.</p>
<p>But there&#8217;s nothing intrinsically sacred, let alone salvific, about the 6th-century fancy dress that comprise the inherited vestment style of the traditional churches. Once, long ago, they really made an impression on the worshipper: imagine what it must have been like to be a medieval peasant&#8211;with an experience of clothing, fabric, and design that was completely utilitarian&#8211;who sees a priest in his shimmering vestments, feels the rich weaving of the fabric as the celebrant passes in procession.</p>
<p>We today, who have riches and design all around us, really can&#8217;t get that same feeling&#8211;and maybe we&#8217;re missing part of the total liturgical experience thereby. I get it that the vestments on display are not to your taste. But I don&#8217;t think they&#8217;re laughable or undignified. And at least they&#8217;re trying to apply art and craft, in a reverent way, to liturgy, with a view to edifying the worshipper.</p>
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		<title>By: Ellyn</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2013/01/24/clerical-fashions/comment-page-1/#comment-87980</link>
		<dc:creator>Ellyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2013 17:48:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/?p=56170#comment-87980</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Eye soap.  Where&#039;s the eye soap?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eye soap.  Where&#8217;s the eye soap?</p>
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