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	<title>Comments on: More On The Media, Conservatives And The Young</title>
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	<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/2012/08/23/more-on-the-media-conservatives-and-the-young/</link>
	<description>A First Things Blog</description>
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		<title>By: The Media, Social Networks, And Civility &#187; Postmodern Conservative &#124; A First Things Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/2012/08/23/more-on-the-media-conservatives-and-the-young/comment-page-1/#comment-31644</link>
		<dc:creator>The Media, Social Networks, And Civility &#187; Postmodern Conservative &#124; A First Things Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Dec 2012 01:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/?p=8415#comment-31644</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] the norms of mainstream media news programs to get their message across. Media consumption patterns have changed and those methods (especially the thirty second ad) don&#8217;t work as well. The [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the norms of mainstream media news programs to get their message across. Media consumption patterns have changed and those methods (especially the thirty second ad) don&#8217;t work as well. The [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck Watts</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/2012/08/23/more-on-the-media-conservatives-and-the-young/comment-page-1/#comment-21828</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck Watts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 22:27:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/?p=8415#comment-21828</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just found your blog. I&#039;m not sure what you mean by &quot;center-right.&quot; My Republican co-founder and I (I&#039;m a life-long Dem) believe compassion and responsibility for/to others, as well as self-reliance, belong in effective public government. Those values are hard to find on Fox or MSNBC, since they are BOTH &quot;corporate&quot; media, which last time I looked are neither empathic OR responsible to our American communities. Shouldn&#039;t we be talking about how to foster these values among the young, since they are the future AND will be taking care of us (or not) when we&#039;re old?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just found your blog. I&#8217;m not sure what you mean by &#8220;center-right.&#8221; My Republican co-founder and I (I&#8217;m a life-long Dem) believe compassion and responsibility for/to others, as well as self-reliance, belong in effective public government. Those values are hard to find on Fox or MSNBC, since they are BOTH &#8220;corporate&#8221; media, which last time I looked are neither empathic OR responsible to our American communities. Shouldn&#8217;t we be talking about how to foster these values among the young, since they are the future AND will be taking care of us (or not) when we&#8217;re old?</p>
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		<title>By: Kate Pitrone</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/2012/08/23/more-on-the-media-conservatives-and-the-young/comment-page-1/#comment-21820</link>
		<dc:creator>Kate Pitrone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 13:16:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/?p=8415#comment-21820</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have to agree with my students about Fox News, et al, that they are about insufferable.  I get young men in class who love them and can repeat the catch-phrases without thought or irony.  However, most of my students get their news from the political comedy shows, which are all about irony: Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert.  &quot;That&#039;s not news&quot; I say, but they cannot stand watching or hearing the news.  Poor kids. Lots of choices and none of them good.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with my students about Fox News, et al, that they are about insufferable.  I get young men in class who love them and can repeat the catch-phrases without thought or irony.  However, most of my students get their news from the political comedy shows, which are all about irony: Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert.  &#8220;That&#8217;s not news&#8221; I say, but they cannot stand watching or hearing the news.  Poor kids. Lots of choices and none of them good.</p>
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		<title>By: John Presnall</title>
		<link>http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/2012/08/23/more-on-the-media-conservatives-and-the-young/comment-page-1/#comment-21810</link>
		<dc:creator>John Presnall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 05:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/postmodernconservative/?p=8415#comment-21810</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I suspect that the reaction-formation (how&#039;s that for jargon?) of youth with regard to the media they watch is more complicated than ordinarily presented. Clueless teachers spend an inordinate time on the importance of &quot;teaching tolerance,&quot; and fighting against &quot;racism.&quot; Yet these things seem to continue, i.e, actions and attitudes against tolerance and for racism.

Teachers love to sigh at the retrograde attitudes and habits of their charge, and then they ask for more money to justify their quixotic endeavor. Apparently clueless teachers know how to educate--as formation--their students better than family, friends, neighbors, the media, the law, the cops, etc.

Meanwhile, the youth watch De Palma&#039;s &quot;Scarface,&quot; and they play-act paddy-cake Tony Montana&#039;s ridiculous criminality. They love his bravado, because that movie (in its genius) also incorporates within itself the right minded critique of good liberal moralization to its main character&#039;s depravity. In so incorporating this disdain, the untaught youth see the movie as another example of taking the piss out of the sclerotic morality of parents and teachers that no one amongst their elders seems to be able to live up to anyway. What with high divorce rates and Joe Paterno--who can say anything?

Nonetheless, we elders must make sure they score high on test scores, and make sure they bow down to the bitch goddess of success as so defined by experts in social science and education theory. 

The youth are more savvy in their readings of popular culture and latch onto the better renditions of it, e.g., &quot;Scarface,&quot; in that they can smell the merde presented to them as wholesome entertainment that straightforwardly tries to teach otherwise. 

This is one reason why it&#039;s best to keep Homer or Shakespeare or Faulkner in the curriculum. But parents will complain--as when I tried to teach Sophocles and was accused of teaching pornography (which in a way I guess it was--but it was important pornography!). Parents and teachers would rather have students watch Kirk Cameron movies, or hagiographies to the most acceptable liberal leaders.

Right wing entertainment is another thing. I don&#039;t really care for it. It usually shows itself as cartoonish as most left wing entertainment. If you could assign Celine&#039;s Journey to the End of the Night, that would be one thing. I wonder what the reaction would be to Walker Percy&#039;s Lancelot. Not good, I suspect.

The key to good novels or television or movies is not to preach in an obvious manner. Not to have lame gimmicks as a substitute to telling a good story--like Tony Soprano on the couch, Walter White dying of cancer, or Don Draper acting cool in a cartoon situation of the past.

Tony Montana was more honest, but that movie incorporates its own critique--a critique only smart teachers can show, and not the type in charge of education these days.

See Chris Dumas--

http://www.amazon.com/Un-American-Psycho-Brian-Political-Invisible/dp/1841505544/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&amp;ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1345782333&amp;sr=1-1&amp;keywords=unamerican+psycho]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suspect that the reaction-formation (how&#8217;s that for jargon?) of youth with regard to the media they watch is more complicated than ordinarily presented. Clueless teachers spend an inordinate time on the importance of &#8220;teaching tolerance,&#8221; and fighting against &#8220;racism.&#8221; Yet these things seem to continue, i.e, actions and attitudes against tolerance and for racism.</p>
<p>Teachers love to sigh at the retrograde attitudes and habits of their charge, and then they ask for more money to justify their quixotic endeavor. Apparently clueless teachers know how to educate&#8211;as formation&#8211;their students better than family, friends, neighbors, the media, the law, the cops, etc.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, the youth watch De Palma&#8217;s &#8220;Scarface,&#8221; and they play-act paddy-cake Tony Montana&#8217;s ridiculous criminality. They love his bravado, because that movie (in its genius) also incorporates within itself the right minded critique of good liberal moralization to its main character&#8217;s depravity. In so incorporating this disdain, the untaught youth see the movie as another example of taking the piss out of the sclerotic morality of parents and teachers that no one amongst their elders seems to be able to live up to anyway. What with high divorce rates and Joe Paterno&#8211;who can say anything?</p>
<p>Nonetheless, we elders must make sure they score high on test scores, and make sure they bow down to the bitch goddess of success as so defined by experts in social science and education theory. </p>
<p>The youth are more savvy in their readings of popular culture and latch onto the better renditions of it, e.g., &#8220;Scarface,&#8221; in that they can smell the merde presented to them as wholesome entertainment that straightforwardly tries to teach otherwise. </p>
<p>This is one reason why it&#8217;s best to keep Homer or Shakespeare or Faulkner in the curriculum. But parents will complain&#8211;as when I tried to teach Sophocles and was accused of teaching pornography (which in a way I guess it was&#8211;but it was important pornography!). Parents and teachers would rather have students watch Kirk Cameron movies, or hagiographies to the most acceptable liberal leaders.</p>
<p>Right wing entertainment is another thing. I don&#8217;t really care for it. It usually shows itself as cartoonish as most left wing entertainment. If you could assign Celine&#8217;s Journey to the End of the Night, that would be one thing. I wonder what the reaction would be to Walker Percy&#8217;s Lancelot. Not good, I suspect.</p>
<p>The key to good novels or television or movies is not to preach in an obvious manner. Not to have lame gimmicks as a substitute to telling a good story&#8211;like Tony Soprano on the couch, Walter White dying of cancer, or Don Draper acting cool in a cartoon situation of the past.</p>
<p>Tony Montana was more honest, but that movie incorporates its own critique&#8211;a critique only smart teachers can show, and not the type in charge of education these days.</p>
<p>See Chris Dumas&#8211;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/Un-American-Psycho-Brian-Political-Invisible/dp/1841505544/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&#038;ie=UTF8&#038;qid=1345782333&#038;sr=1-1&#038;keywords=unamerican+psycho" rel="nofollow">http://www.amazon.com/Un-American-Psycho-Brian-Political-Invisible/dp/1841505544/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&#038;ie=UTF8&#038;qid=1345782333&#038;sr=1-1&#038;keywords=unamerican+psycho</a></p>
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