Ah. Now all becomes clear.

Just kidding Ramon. Sort of.

Thanks for your posts. I hope you’ll have chance to get back, it’s been to get your point of view on this topic especially.

Although I enjoy it, I just don’t have the time for lengthy discussion and as you have pointed out, I am not the best at debate and sometimes my arguments might be unclear or not specific. I apologize, I was an engineer in college, of course, so my writing skills lag behind my analytic ability.

My arguments however based on my personal experience/perceptions and that is something you cannot change with internet chat and some links.
But, I appreciate your comments and the links. I will look at them over time and give it thought.
I think you understand that I know there are a lot good people in the GOP and don’t hold you or anyone on this board personally responsible for the perceptions I hold, but what I need to vote more Republican in the future is more positive interaction with Republicans in all venues (professional, social and political events).

BTW, my ultra-liberal southern born/raised Caucasian wife (who would have thought?) is dragging me to one of her small business owner (she has her own company) democratic group meetings in a few weeks, I don’t know the exact name/venue but you can bet I will give them an earful of what I don’t like (as mentioned in previous posts). At least their asking and engaging me.

Perhaps he could have tied and gagged him and locked him in a small room where nobody could see or hear him. That would have helped because, unlike your claim in the OP, the Republican party’s problem is not “…that the entire center-right infrastructure is unable to communicate intelligibly to a large and growing fraction of the population.”

If that was the GOP’s problem, then Ryan would have been a real help to the ticket because every time he opened his mouth he communicated exactly what the Republican party stands for: cutting taxes, coddling the super wealthy, shipping jobs overseas, destroying American manufacturing, destroying the middle class, letting Al Qaeda blow up New York and the Pentagon, starting wars all over the world that they couldn’t win or even afford, running up a $10 trillion dollar national debt and giving us a 1929 style crash that took down the entire world economy.

We heard Paul loud and clear!

My questions are intended in exactly the spirit you’ve answered them – to gain a little bit more clarity on the reasons why those in demographics such as yourself voted the way you voted. So in this spirit, regarding your answers:

Q1. What I asked you was on what BASIS would you differ from the view that somehow Republican obstructionism was motivated by race when we saw the same behavior among Republican’s in Clinton’s first term. You’ve clarified that you do see their behavior toward Obama as racially motivated, but it seems clear that their record in the early 90′s presents clear counterfactual evidence that policy is sufficient to motivate the kind of obstructionism we saw against Obama. Is it possible, that your view of Republican motives is inclined to impute racial motives where there are none?

Q2. I asked in ‘in what WAYS do you see Democrats as authentically inclusive of minority opinion where Republicans are not?’ Not on what topics.

So could you explain in what ways Democrats are authentically inclusive of minority opinion on immigration. Especially since in Obama’s first two years they had both houses of congress, a supermajority in the senate, and a president in the White House with HUGE political capital and they did NOTHING on immigration reform?

Is it possible that the democratic party understands that the present irresolved status-quo on immigration gives them a tactical advantage that they would not have if immigration were finally truly reformed? If you don’t think so, why not, in light of the fact that they had a chance to do something yet didn’t?

Q3. Thanks for clarifying things on this point. Your following words were certainly clarifying:

“By bashing Mexicans and Blacks I mean in private conversations that I either overhear or directly when people assume “I’m with them”. This has happened many times in meetings with Republicans. I don’t like it when they generalize a whole race, I can only wonder what they think of my race.”

My observation here is that I had the experience of hearing quit a bit of prejudice too, but directed at Romney’s ‘cult like’ mormon religion, and the insidious motives of successful businessmen. In fact daily on my facebook I was regailed with posts from friends and family demonizing a very decent man for the crime of being successful.

What I found incredible though was that it was the Obama campaign that made prejudice a centerpiece in its strategy to win election when it ran this campaign in Ohio:

http://legalinsurrection.com/2012/10/obamas-last-hand-to-play-the-other-card/

Or if you prefer the Washington Post:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/decision2012/obama-mitt-romney-not-one-of-us/2012/10/22/e78714ba-1bb3-11e2-9cd5-b55c38388962_story.html

My point here is that there’s a lot of ugly stuff being said among the rank-and-file on both the left and the right, but imputing that to the candidates in the case of Romney seems selective when the Obama campaign was actually leveraging fear of the other as a centerpiece in its campaign strategy in Ohio.

It’s interesting that as a minority businessman, you represent both potential targets of prejudice. So, at the risk of straining your patience, could I ask you why it is that you were not offended by the clear anti-businessman narrative of the Obama campaign, but, instead, were sufficiently offended by the racial prejudice you found, NOT in Romney’s campaign, but merely among conservative individuals that you voted for Obama? This despite the fact that between the two candidates it was the candidate you voted for that was engaging in class based xenophobia?

Again, I hope your receive these questions in the constructive spirit in which they are asked. I’m not interested in bashing. I’m trying to understand your statements in light of, what to a conservative perspective of what took place, seems surprising and even paradoxical.

Rock County went Democrat in 2010 even when the rest of the state was going Republican for governor and Senator. Ryan ran 11 points or so ahead of Romney in Rock County and got about the percentage of votes that Republicans usually get there when they win statewide. Maybe he wasn’t the problem.

“Being a Republican, maybe this is a surprise to you, but the average American voter doesn’t think that sacrificing a big chunk of the Social Security and Medicare they’ve been PAYING FOR all their adult lives…”

I have some really bad news for you. Paul Ryan and Obama have proposed to cut Medicare by the exact same amount. You must feel so betrayed. Now, a better use of Paul Ryan might have not put you in a position to make such a mistake. Then again, your ego-investment in hating Ryan might have gotten in the way (that’s how I’m betting.)

I think the Democrats’ crooning over winning a super majority (which they only had for 6 months) and Pelosi’s promise to use it to push for a agenda that would extend and secure the Great Society project had a lot to do with the obstructionism the GOP became known for. Especially when they realized not every Democrat was on board with Pelosi and Reid. They could block what they saw as a radical agenda (and Pelosi was promising to her own radical supporters). So everything began with a liberal overreach (97-0 against ring a bell?) only to take months for wounds to heal, trust to be built and a series of committees to start anew and finally last minute vote buying.

First rule of opposing a party machine is to not show it any legitimacy, the second rule is to do anything to prevent them from conducting their business, the third rule is to expose their corruption.