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Spengler Forum at First Things • View topic - Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

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Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby lzzrdgrrl » Fri Sep 10, 2010 12:38 am

Frodo wrote:
lzzrdgrrl wrote:That is not the point......

A military that becomes comfortable in launching a decidedly political viewpoint into the public sphere, may start to become comfortable in actively advocating and promoting that viewpoint. Then, it may become quite comfortable in enforcing it, and suppressing dissenting views.......

Let me know when Jones is in military detention. :roll:


Kay...... It is not that far outside of possibility. Let this resemble something that can be construed as a national emergency and our Jones will find himself in a little room someplace. "For his own protection", of course.......
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby Frodo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 1:06 am

lzzrdgrrl wrote:
Frodo wrote:
lzzrdgrrl wrote:That is not the point......

A military that becomes comfortable in launching a decidedly political viewpoint into the public sphere, may start to become comfortable in actively advocating and promoting that viewpoint. Then, it may become quite comfortable in enforcing it, and suppressing dissenting views.......

Let me know when Jones is in military detention. :roll:


Kay...... It is not that far outside of possibility. Let this resemble something that can be construed as a national emergency and our Jones will find himself in a little room someplace. "For his own protection", of course.......


I'm still waiting for Jones to be forced in to custody for real. What happens in your imagination doesn't count as coercion. Kay?
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby madafonos » Fri Sep 10, 2010 12:09 pm

HN: Fine contributions, lzzrdgrrl and Alexis.

There is a similarity between Saudi/Rauf Cordoba Center and this incident: both instances of modified-WHAM and exhibition of Progressive claptrap. Said ZBW's insist Islamist hatred of West can be influenced by 'being nice' -- same logic as parental 'no hitting' (ever) guidance; fine for cloistered Upper West Side, but dangerous in real world. Note the complete lack of traction for ZBW narrative in Al Jazeera, Al Arabiya, BBC and their ilk. This is almost as pathetic as SoI thinking it can shape media efforts aimed at its destruction.

Why make costly public displays and symbolic overtures towards people who want you to ESaD? Granted, US Treasury needs (owing largely to R32 and J36 nonsense, inflated by O44 & Co) indicate some nominal level of genuflection required ...

Will suggest a corrective: representative sample of ZBW's visit AfPAK and 'Muslim world', wherever that nonsense term may be, on a "Healing through Hearing" town-hall style tour, sans security -- selfsame self-appointed mental and moral giants revile the PSC's and military, after all.

Net-net, not to worry in re: arousing anger of 'Muslim street' -- at worst, confirmatory of existing opinion: it's not as though wailing cut-cats can be further incited, despite what intellectually bankrupt Western 'leaders' insist. What we've witnessed over past decade is = NOT = restraint, but rather the best they have to offer.


As re: Petraeus;

Take a closer look -- in particular, the initials following his name and the career track: he is the object of secular hagiography, a perfumed prince in the RAND mold, groomed for public presentation and consumption.

Besides being wrong in re: Petraeus, 'common coin' also errs re: 'The Surge' -- whatever success latter stages of OIF met, this owes to factors largely outside public discourse (on purpose; don't want to distract populace from their distractions, after all). Please don't sick the SWJ crowd of true-believers in modified-WHAM ala-Petraeus on me ...

See, for instance (apologies for block-quote):
I would be in that camp that argues for the Marine tactics being the necessary and sufficient root cause of the success in Anbar (even though the campaign would have been longer and bloodier without the tribes). But I would also give a moderately different take on what Matt calls the “ignition switch.” While acknowledging Patriquin’s service and sacrifice, I am told by Army intelligence that the ignition switch for the tribal evolution away from support to AQ was in no small part our kinetic operations against the smuggling lines of Sheikh Abdul Sattar Abu Risha, even killing members of his extended family. He sided with us in order to keep from losing everything.

I have been told by officers as high as Colonel (unnamed, in Iraq at the time) that the plan General Petraeus took to Iraq was dead on arrival because the logistics officers told him it was impossible. His genius was in his ability to quickly amend his plan. But as Colonel Gian Gentile and I have discussed, the success of the radical shift in strategy Petraeus brought to Iraq is the populist narrative. Many or even most of the things done in 2007 were being done prior to that, especially in the Anbar Province.

But what’s significant about the surge is the increase in troop levels. While al Qaeda fighters were being killed and chased from the Anbar Province, when they attempted to flee to Baghdad they found a heavy U.S. troop presence to greet them. Instead, they had to flee North to Mosul (with some to the Diyala Province), leaving the seat of power in place in Baghdad.

~ Herschel Smith, Captain's Journal, 31 Aug 10


cf: Forget the Lessons of Iraq
~ MajGen CJ Dunlap, Jr (USAF), AFJ, Jan 2009

See also: here

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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby lzzrdgrrl » Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:22 pm

Frodo wrote:I'm still waiting for Jones to be forced in to custody for real. What happens in your imagination doesn't count as coercion. Kay?


All it would take in the REAL WORLD for this to happen, is for the right people to suggest something about something under the right circumstances and the right people in high places getting a knot in their shimipan over it. We already have examples of this government and administration bulling the Constitution should circumstances require it.....
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby Frodo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:21 pm

lzzrdgrrl wrote:
Frodo wrote:I'm still waiting for Jones to be forced in to custody for real. What happens in your imagination doesn't count as coercion. Kay?


All it would take in the REAL WORLD for this to happen, is for the right people to suggest something about something under the right circumstances and the right people in high places getting a knot in their shimipan over it. We already have examples of this government and administration bulling the Constitution should circumstances require it.....


All it would take in the REAL WORLD for this to happen would be . . . for it to happen in the REAL WORLD.

Got it.
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby Victor » Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:26 pm

Frodo said:
All it would take in the REAL WORLD for this to happen would be . . . for it to happen in the REAL WORLD.

Got it.


TOP SECRET MATERIAL!

We've got to lighten UP folks cause Frodo might be right! But don't worry cause in the spiritual fictional world, I've sent some of my cells to check out the pass but "IT" is taking an eternity for most of them to report as to what they've found. For example, some of them spoke to Pilote and asked his cells if Jesus was for real and some of Pilote's brain cells those my brain cells, without making a sound mind you, that He certainly was and the majority of Pilote's cells are backing "IT" Up by leaving that sign on the cross which says something like "King of the Jews" in three languages. Now folks, don't start spreading that around cause "IT" might not be so funny as what might happen if any powerful spiritual Jewish cells get wind of "IT" if you know what I mean?

Folks! What we really need to worry about is if these travelling so called imaginary spiritual cells disguised as humans start thinking that they really are so called gods and team UP with ESC, DNA, and all kinds of Jeans and put them into Heavenly Bodies! Now that would be scary in the real world but for some sinners "IT" might be very enjoyable! Go Figure.

Anyway! What I'm concerned about for humanity''s sake is that they don't try taking over our Heavenly Father's Kingdom again cause "IT" is hopeless! You got "IT"! Yes "IT" has already been tried over two thousand years ago or to be exact, when all so called alien sinning cells thought that they could not be beat so what did they do you might ask! Don't tell these so called brain cell gods that you got "IT" from me, just tell them that you got "IT" from "The Good Book" ,which I don't read any, of course, and please also forgive me if I don't start naming the book cause some of my cells might be accused of having burnt some if you know what I mean? I'll just say that kissing UP didn't quiet do "IT" for these so called gods cause Jesus' Heavenly Father was already wise to these travelling so called soldier cells. If you don't believe me just check out those famous words, "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?" For those who don't have enough faith, there's nothing I, me, myself in the flesh could say that would be believable.


I hear ya! Have you been drinking again Victor?

Just a little red wine and trust me, "IT" sure is good! 8)
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby Frodo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:57 pm

Someone should have put up the Do Not Disturb sign. The cleaning lady always shows up at the worst time.
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Re: Where Does It Stop, Gen. Petraeus?

Postby Victor » Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:02 pm

by Frodo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:57 pm

Someone should have put up the Do Not Disturb sign. The cleaning lady always shows up at the worst time.


I personally don't usually mind as long as she's charming! :)
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