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David Mills

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Late to the Debt Party

Though it was launched just eleven days ago, no one, judging from a google search of the title, is still talking about A Call for Intergenerational Justice, a new statement by the Evangelical Left, who are suddenly and for the first time worried about governmental debt. The statement, subtitled “A Christian Response for the American Debt Crisis,” has just 397 signatures as I write, and has added just two in the twelve hours since I first checked.

The nineteen initial signers include Sojourner’s Jim Wallis, author of much noticed books on politics, former Bush speechwriter and Washington Post columnist Michael Gerson, Fuller seminary president Richard Mouw, Christianity Today editor Andy Crouch, Celebration of Discipline author Richard Foster, Baptist theologian David Gushee, and Richard Cizik, once the National Association of Evangelicals’ Washington lobbyist, who was asked to resign after being widely criticized for saying on NPR that he favored civil unions for homosexual people.

It’s a group of considerable weight, not just in the Evangelical world but (with Wallis and Gerson) in the wider world of American politics, yet no one, as I said, seems to have noticed they’d gotten together and said something about the economy. Other, that is, than their ideological opponents at the Acton Institute, and even there, their work is being discussed only by one Evangelical blogger, who I suspect looks at the statement the way eager hunters once looked at the Dodo Bird.

Written by Ronald Sider, the head of Evangelicals for Social Action (and a contributor to First Things), and Gideon Strauss, the head of the Center for Public Justice, the Call declares that


Our growing national debt now puts us on a path towards economic disaster. If unchanged, our current culture of debt threatens to bankrupt us both economically and morally. The biblical call to stewardship demands that we pass on an economic order in which our children and their children can flourish. . . . Today’s federal debts threaten not only the present generation, but also our children and generations yet unborn. Intergenerational justice demands that one generation must not benefit or suffer unfairly at the cost of another.

It goes on to assign the blame for the “culture of debt” on a “materialistic, live-for-the-moment mentality,” as practiced by families and businesses, but not as promoted and enabled by government. The writers never blame—they never even mention—social spending and the government’s never-ending attempt to solve all human problems by throwing money at them, and the government’s “live-for-the-moment” accumulation of debt to pay for everyone’s favorite program. An attempt, mind you, that those members of the Evangelical Left who have been speaking on such things for years inevitably supported.

The Call offers several policy proposals but avoids “any detailed agenda,” the writers admitting that “experts disagree.” They still insist, on what grounds they do not explain, that “it is clear that a bipartisan agreement must include the following basic elements”: cutting the federal budget, controlling health care expenses, sustaining Social Security, and reforming the tax code.

This is the Call’s central claim, but instead of arguing for it they simply assert that it is clearly true, and in the context of the statement clearly Christian. You might think that a case could be made, because it has been made, for phasing out and privatizing Social Security as a way of achieving some degree of intergenerational justice when the ratio of workers to beneficiaries is steadily declining. Why “it is clear” that we cannot agree on this but must believe in sustaining Social Security is not, really, clear.

For the most part the statement only gives very general practical proposals for enacting these four basic elements. A few are a little more specific, like raising the retirement age for Social Security and increasing the Social Security tax, but even here the statement doesn’t say how much these should be raised, and why, which are the crucial and vexing questions.

It is more specific in what it does not say. “We must cut federal spending,” the writers declare, but their proposals for cutting the federal budget include only cutting “corporate and agricultural subsidies, the defense budget and salary increases [sic] of federal employees,” but not re-examining and trimming or eliminating social welfare programs.

The fault, in other words, is individual’s and businesses, not government’s, except for the defense department. The answer is to take money from individuals and businesses, and from the Department of Defense. Surely, one would think, they’d admit that some social programs in a government as big as ours might not work very well and might waste money, quite possibly a lot of it? But they don’t.

Others can examine the Call’s economics, if they can find any idea concrete enough to examine.
I will make only one criticism, and this has to do with a movement like that issuing a statement like this. They are very late to the party, and they ought to apologize for being late before they start talking about it as if they’d helped plan it.

Conservatives have warned about the debt for decades and in response to cries to solve this or that problem with more government spending, have kept pointing out that there is only so much money to be had. (Conservative does not, I might note, equal Republican; Republicans having been nearly as profligate as their Democratic opponents.) The insight the signers of the Call have dressed up as “intergenerational justice” was a major and frequent insight of the conservative case: that, as the point was often put, by spending so much more money than we have to spend, we are mortgaging our children’s and grandchildren’s futures.

In that time, the Evangelical Left said nothing besides “God insists the government spend more money.” They steadily identified the Christian concern for the poor with advocating that the government create new social programs and give more money to the ones already created. The subtext of nearly every statement from the Evangelical Left was that those who wanted to cut taxes and reduce the size of the government were selfish swine who didn’t care for the poor the way they, and Jesus, did. They would not allow that one might believe, and with good reason, that less government might help the poor stop being “the poor.”

One is not assured of their political seriousness, nor of their economic insights, when they come to an issue only after it can’t be ignored. And even then, while granting the point everyone now makes, issue a statement that does not actually address the problem but only concedes as much as it has to in order to maintain something as close to the previous status quo as they can. Maybe this explains why no one seems interested in A Call for Intergenerational Justice.

Having long advocated not only policies, but the kind of statist mind that has led us to the debt crisis, the Evangelical Left now jumps onto the bandwagon as if they’d been there all along. They ought first to admit their failure to think and speak carefully about economics, particularly about the intractable conflict between what we would like to do and what we can afford to do, and then reflect on why they went wrong. Then their next call for justice might say something to which people will listen.

David Mills is Deputy Editor of
First Things. His previous “On the Square” articles can be found here.

RESOURCES

The Center for Public Justice’s A Call for Intergenerational Justice: A Christian Proposal for the American Debt Crisis.
Jordan J. Ballor’s Initial Thoughts on Intergenerational Justice and Abortion and Intergenerational Justice.
Greg Forster’s More on Evangelicals and Entitlements.

Comments:

3.14.2011 | 8:06am
ferd says:
The religious Left has enabled the dysfunction of destructive secular ideals to play out in Western culture. They have distorted the biblical call to care for the anawim ("the poor, the widow, the orphan and the stranger in your land") to include fat Americans with cars and TVs. They have distorted the call for peace building to the point of an American withdrawal from the world stage which would, of course, not lead to much peace at all!
The religious Left's constant hammering on Defense spending is another example of their short sightedness. It led to this looming disaster in our current and future fiscal policy...it will lead to disaster (and the bloodshed of the true anawim) on the world stage.
3.14.2011 | 10:33am
Jordan says:
I appreciate Mr. Mills' call to engage the economics of these questions, especially as neither I in particular nor the Acton Institute more generally is alone in so doing. One point that is not sufficiently brought out here is that all of the signers do not in fact agree about the economic question. This incoherence has been one of my major criticisms of the document:

http://blog.acton.org/tag/a-call-for-intergenerational-justice
3.14.2011 | 10:51am
Bop says:
When I first looked it was all abuzz about the chronic debt problem bequeathed by the dizzying spendthrift Reagan. During Clinton’s term (God bless the man, a wonderful human being, vilified by sleaze merchants such as Starr and DeLay who weren’t fit to lick his boots but only fit to manufacture slander and calumny against their neighbor) they used to gosh golly us about how every minute another gazillion in interest was added to the debt and then, in the twinkling of an eye, didn’t Clinton solve that problem. Then came GW and didn’t he rack it all up again solving everyone else’s problem by blowing them up with shock and awe and letting his own people go without out so he could do so. And then Obama comes along and spends to help his own people and don’t the eggers on of Starr and DeLay go all unctuous about how these lefties never learn.
3.14.2011 | 11:04am
Todd says:
On the other hand, we heard very little from the Right on debt until it could be used as a political tool when they were disenfranchised from majority rule.

The equitable thing would seem to be to raise taxes on corporations and individuals and let economic competition fall where it may. But the Right seems content to target the middle class (unions) and the poor (safety net) rather than the robber barons of the banking class.

When will you guys wake up and go after criminals rather than the law-abiding citizenry?
3.14.2011 | 11:13am
Bop says:
Dear Mr. Mills,

What on earth is a statist mind? Is wanting all Americans to have decent health care a symptom of possessing a statist mind? Is the belief that running a country is not the same thing as running an economy a sickness of the statist mind? When you say God bless America what do you mean?
3.14.2011 | 11:38am
MJ says:
I'm very confused by the fact that you have lumped Michael Gerson into the "Evangelical Left." Didn't he coin the phrase 'compassionate conservative?' And doesn't this broader range of voices give the document a slightly different tone? It seems to me that it is not a response by the Evangelical Left, but a response by some concerned Evangelicals.
3.14.2011 | 12:01pm
JP says:
Numbers can be pesky things. And as the late Patrick Moynahan once quipped, "We are entitled to our opinions. But we are not entitled to our own facts." The defecit as it currently stands isn't a function of too few taxes, but too much spending. From 2001 to 2009, President Bush signed into law budgets that produced over his tenure some $3 trillion in defecits. From 2009 to the present, President Obama has produced $5 trillion in additional defecits. In Feb 2011 alone, the defecit totaled more than $200 billion. At the current rate, the federal government is borrowing $4 billion a day. The last budget defecit before the Great Recession hit was $178 billion for FY 2007. Currently the federal government is spending roughly $4 trillion a year, of which it recieves about $2.2 trillion in tax revenue. For FY2000-2001 (the last Clinton Budget) revenues account for about $1.8 trillion. We are spending $2 trillion more per year than we did a decade ago.

The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan cannot account for this defecit. Operations in Iraq are rapidly drawing down, and combat ops and aid to Afghanistan comes to rougly $120 billion a year. Yes, the Baby Boomer are retiring, but the additional increases to Social Security and Medicare do not even come close to the $2 trillion in additional spending. However, Medicaid is exploding in costs. It is only about $100 billion less than the DOD spend, and is forecasted to surpass defense spending by 2014. Ditto for Education. From K-12 to DOE block grants to increased funds for Pell grants the DOE spending has almost doubled in 2 years. Unemployment compensation this year will almost equal what we spend for Medicare, and increases in social welfare projects and lower eligiability requirements have casued doubliing in this area. Add in $100 billion a year for additional HHS costs for ObamaCare (through 2015), large increases in subsidies for alternative fuels (ie ethanol, wind turbines, solar panels, etc), $160 billion to subsidize light rail), operational cost increases to cover some new 200,000 federal employees, as well as money to fund projects in inner cities, and the rural poor and you get the idea. As of last month, almost 30% of all payrolls are derived from income transfer via the federal government.

Nope, the $2 trillion in extra spending (of which 80% is new spending) and it is more than obvious the defecit is a function of our political class addiction to taxpayers money. If there aren't enough taxpayers now to cover the costs, spread the costs to future taxpayers. One problem (besides the moral problem) with this way of governing is the simple fact that we've injected some $5 trillion of cash into our economy without a simple demand side to absorb it. Simply put, we're inflating our money supply big time.

Progressive Christian groups may pay lip service, but obviously they don't wish to stop the federal gravy train. Wallis and his ilk simply blame "consumerism", Bush-Cheny-Haliburton, and of course the banks. But none can agree to cut one program outside of defense. Whether secular or Christian, Progressives never found a domestic spending program they didn't like.
3.14.2011 | 12:23pm
David MIlls says:
MJ: Marvin Olasky, the publisher of *World* magazine, coined the phrase "compassionate conservatism," and I'm fairly sure he doesn't think this statement a particularly conservative one. I think "Evangelical Left" is a good name for the group as a whole, even if some more conservative people joined them, given the positions of the authors and signers like Wallis and Cizik, as well as the nature of the statement itself. Gerson's influence at the White House seems to have been to urge Bush spend more money.
3.14.2011 | 12:46pm
The Center for Public Justice is not part of the evangelical left. The document notes that it is a bipartisan agreement and should be understood in that context. I say more about there here: http://www.thinkingevangelical.com/2011/03/call-for-intergenerational-justice.html
3.14.2011 | 1:32pm
hippocrates says:
"A call for intergenerational justice" disagrees, however vaguely and ineffectively,
with the President's budget and his overall economic plan. So it needs to be called what it is : Racism
3.14.2011 | 1:55pm
Henry James says:
Of course the Left has complained about the National Debt; for decades. And the Deficit too; especially during the Reagan years, when it began to grow, massively.

To be sure, there was less reason to stress all that ... during the Liberal administration of Bill Clinton. Since Clinton all but eliminated the budget deficit, and turned in a surplus.

There was no need to talk much about such things - because things were going fine under Liberalism.

Things in fact went well until ... conservative George Bush II. Who 1) crashed the mortgage support mechanism; who 2) started a couple of interminable and expensive wars; who then 3) crashed the economy; and 4) crashed the Stock Market. And who finally 5) ran unemployment up to historic levels; the worse since the Reagan Recession.

By the way? The word "conservative" is never mentioned in the Bible; but the word "liberal" is. When the Bible tells us to "be liberal" in helping the poor.
3.14.2011 | 2:23pm
Bob G says:
Look on the bright side: even these people now admit there actually is a problem. It's also clear that their anodynes will not help much, so look at this as just the start of their revaluation.

I've said this a million times but will say it again: the left (including the evangelical variety) is just as correct about our Capitalist economy as is the right. Our system has always had (as Marx said) a "class bias" that the left has tried to counteract through Gummint. That only made the problem worse, but the problem was and is real. The Market indeed is the "natural" structure for a healthy economics, but the way Capitalism formulated the question was and is flawed. Bottom line: the right's nostrums will work no better than the left's. We will NOT be coming out of this "recession"; this is not just another iteration of a recurrent cycle, as the Fed still thinks. Something fundamental has changed. We are at the start of an epochal civilizational shift that will sweep up the right as well as the left. Good luck to all.
3.14.2011 | 2:45pm
"The equitable thing would seem to be to raise taxes on corporations and individuals and let economic competition fall where it may. "

(1) Since we already have the highest corporate tax rate in the developed world, you think we should raise it even more? How do you think corporations are going to respond to that?

(2) As Kevin Williamson's article today at National Review clearly demonstrates, "taxing the rich" is not going to solve the deficit problem. There are not enough rich people.
3.14.2011 | 3:09pm
Fred says:
@Henry James,

Nice revisionism there. It has all the right black hats and white hats, but unfortunately, reality is a bit more complex. The left has complained about the deficit primarily when they could use it as a stick with which to beat conservatives/Republicans. Where are they now that Obama is tripling the (already bad) Bush deficits?

Secondly, calling Bill Clinton's administration "liberal" is like calling Richard Nixon's administration "conservative" (you remember, the administration with wage and price freezes, affirmative action, "we're all Keynesians now" and "watch what we do, not what we say"). Clinton began as a liberal in 93, but got his a** handed to him in the 94 election. After that, remember "The era of big government is over," welfare reform, and triangulation? Clinton essentially governed as a moderate Republican. In addition, much of his "surplus" was generated by the dotcom bubble (which Clinton had little to do with) and evaporated when that bubble burst.

While W certainly ran up the deficit (for which he was roundly criticized by many conservatives then and now), that does not excuse Obama's reckless piling on. When it comes to spending, Obama makes W look like Silas Marner. As for collapsing the mortgage market, the wind-up for that pitch goes back to the Community Reinvestment Act in 1977. In fact, in 2003 (I believe it was), Bush attempted to get congress to reform Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, but they refused. And if you recall, the Democrats ran congress for 2 years before the crash. Why don't they bear any responsibility? True, they didn't have a veto-proof majority, but if they had seen the crash coming and publicized those concerns, they would have benefitted enormously. Why didn't they? Could it be because they were just as responsible as W if not more so?

And your final comment is the logical fallacy of equivocation (not to mention just plain silly). Leaving aside complexities of translation, when the Bible uses the word "liberal" it is in the original sense of "generous," not in the contemporary American political sense.

You need to think through your comments more. There are some rather intelligent people at this site.
3.14.2011 | 3:36pm
Bop says:
Yo Fred:
“While W certainly ran up the deficit (for which he was roundly criticized by many conservatives then and now), that does not excuse Obama's reckless piling on.”

If conservatives roundly criticized W, how come they voted him in twice? Reagan also piled it on, how come they voted twice for him? W spent money to kill people, Obama spends to save their lives. This is true isn’t it?

“You need to think through your comments more. There are some rather intelligent people at this site.”

Just have to take your word for it.
3.14.2011 | 4:12pm
Matt M says:
I'll agree with the broad consensus of the previous posters: (1) the Intergenerational Justice Statement's solutions conjur the old image of throwing a deck chair off the Titanic. (2) The lines about the urgent necessity of the government's "effective programs" give the nasty implication that conservatives don't care at all about poor people.

But with that said, I do think this was a (small) step in the right direction. The point about many people's, "materialistic, live-for-the-moment mentality" is nudging toward the core problem. After all, if voters weren't so intent on electing candidates who magically promised to concurrently increase funding for government programs while decreasing taxes, we might not have this problem...
3.14.2011 | 4:12pm
JP says:
"To be sure, there was less reason to stress all that ... during the Liberal administration of Bill Clinton. Since Clinton all but eliminated the budget deficit, and turned in a surplus."

@Henry James,

I agree whole heartedly. Let us return to the spending levels of Bill Clinton circa 2000.
3.14.2011 | 4:18pm
"If conservatives roundly criticized W, how come they voted him in twice?"

Because he was better than the alternatives.

"Reagan also piled it on, how come they voted twice for him?"

Since all spending bills have to originate in the House, which was controlled by the Democrats, accusing Reagan of piling it on is a little unfair, don't you think?

"W spent money to kill people, Obama spends to save their lives. This is true isn’t it?"

Not even close to being true. Obama has continued both wars that started under Bush and has launched far more Predator attacks than Bush ever did.
3.14.2011 | 4:49pm
Bob G says:
Matt M: good points. You almost touch on what I think is the basic fact: the American public and voter no longer expect anything of Gummint than that it keep the economy strong. How Gummint does that the public could almost care less. And, really, who can blame it?

That's why all the debaters’ points about whether Clinton or Bush or whoever was more honest or correct are beside the point. We could conduct that debate forever and never move forward an inch. Each side is correct and wrong in its own way and trying to win this battle is the soul of futility. The only thing that can win it is success--meaning prosperity--which neither side can any longer produce. Both sides are going down, and what will come after we can hardly imagine.
3.14.2011 | 5:04pm
Bop says:
Yo Brian English:

“Because he was better than the alternatives.””

The alternatives would have included all other conservatives who chose not to challenge him. So instead of challenging him why did they vote for him?

“Since all spending bills have to originate in the House, which was controlled by the Democrats, accusing Reagan of piling it on is a little unfair, don't you think?”

No, not unfair. While they are democrats, and so presumably wouldn’t know any better, he is a republican president at whom the buck stops.

“Not even close to being true. Obama has continued both wars that started under Bush and has launched far more Predator attacks than Bush ever did.”

It is one thing trying to control and honourably extricate oneself from a mess created by an unthinking, pompous mission completing ass, it is another thing to be the unthinking, pompous mission completing ass who gets us into the mess in the first place.
3.14.2011 | 5:13pm
Fred says:
_Both sides are going down,and what will come after we can hardly imagine._

Maybe, but one thing is certain, whatever it is will not spring whole like Minerva from the head of Zeus. It will arise from debates we are having now. Those debates are important.

Bop,

You've been pretty well schooled by other commenters. Still have to take my word for the intelligence of commenters here?
3.14.2011 | 5:48pm
Henry James says:
Fred:

I here might over-stress the evil in Conservatism ... to counterbalance the opposite anti-Liberal bias, in First Things.

But surely Little George II, did run as a conservative. And as a good capitalist, he labeled this the "ownership society." As part of that, he explicitly supported the extension of lax morgage qualifications. To get more poor people owning homes, and in debt to the banks. A nice idea in some ways. But? Not good business, as we found out.

To be sure, when the BIble told us to "be liberal," it did not refer to all of what we would call Liberalism today. And yet however? There is considerable semantic overlap: the core idea of Liberalism, (and Christianity) was always to help poor and disadvantaged people. And the Health Bill would have done that.

Is Obama contining to spend on the national credit card? Surely everyone knows, this has been an emergeny measure; part of the attempt to "stimulate" a Bush economy,that otherwise might have totalled our economy, c. 2009-10;that might well have created the Second Great Depression.

In fact, Obama's begun to propose a tighter budget. And that becomes plausible ... as soon as the unemployment rate goes down a few more points.

But if that's not enough? Republicans have already advanced the first government program to be cut: Education.

Who needs education, anyway? Surely not Conservatives.
3.14.2011 | 6:51pm
Bop says:
"You've been pretty well schooled by other commenters. Still have to take my word for the intelligence of commenters here?"

I don't know how else in honesty I could accept such a judgement, Fred.
3.14.2011 | 6:52pm
"The alternatives would have included all other conservatives who chose not to challenge him. So instead of challenging him why did they vote for him?"

No one was going to run against a sitting President, and no conservative wanted to see a President Kerry.

"No, not unfair. While they are democrats, and so presumably wouldn’t know any better, he is a republican president at whom the buck stops."

But with the lack of a line item veto, Reagan had to swallow the Democrat spending to get through the defense spending he wanted to back-down the Soviets.

"It is one thing trying to control and honourably extricate oneself from a mess created by an unthinking, pompous mission completing ass, it is another thing to be the unthinking, pompous mission completing ass who gets us into the mess in the first place. "

Are you including Afghanistan in that? And you still haven't addressed the huge increase in Predator attacks. And why is Gitmo still open and the military tribunals being reinstituted?
3.14.2011 | 7:35pm
Bop says:
Brian English:

“No one was going to run against a sitting President, and no conservative wanted to see a President Kerry.”

So not running was not just a failure in intellectual honesty, then, but a failure of nerve too.

“But with the lack of a line item veto, Reagan had to swallow the Democrat spending to get through the defense spending he wanted to back-down the Soviets.”

So in order to “back-down” an imploding, legless Soviet system that Gorbachev was scrambling to reform, Reagan had to oversee a record deficit? Jeez, even democrats don’t dislike Reagan as much as you do.

“Are you including Afghanistan in that? And you still haven't addressed the huge increase in Predator attacks. And why is Gitmo still open and the military tribunals being reinstituted?”

As I say, one hell of a mess the guy you elected twice left.
3.14.2011 | 10:17pm
Argue about the past all you like, the ship is sinking and, unfortunately, President Obama is at the helm.
3.14.2011 | 10:37pm
William F. Buckley had a great phrase "invincible ignorance".

Bop=case in point. Circular reasoning, tunnel vision, dishonesty, creative use of facts and non-facts. What winning form.
3.14.2011 | 10:37pm
james barnes says:
This hits home considering the line of work I'm involved with.
I personally don't blame Obama, we each need to use our own God given right to create our OWN economy.
3.15.2011 | 9:13am
Bop says:
Yo Steve Billingsley:
“Circular reasoning, tunnel vision, dishonesty, creative use of facts and non-facts. What winning form.”

You think that describing it so is the same as showing it so, Steve? Such deceptive sleight of hand is what enables what in fact is better known as “impenetrable ignorance”, and Buckley learned it from Voegelin who learned it from Plato. The impenetrably ignorant are the doubly ignorant, those who don’t know that they don’t know, and Plato contrasted them to the wise who are simply singularly ignorant, those who know that they don’t know. The former are the philodoxers, the lovers of opinion, the latter are philosophers, the lovers of wisdom. Philosophers cannot overcome philodoxers by truth, as the latter cannot recognize truth; philosophers can only overcome philodoxers formally, by playing their silly game better than them.
3.15.2011 | 9:59am
"So not running was not just a failure in intellectual honesty, then, but a failure of nerve too. "

It has nothing to do with nerve or intellectual honesty. It has to do with avoiding an intra-party blood bath that would probably only have resulted in a President Kerry. Get back to me on this when some Democrats run against the guy currently occupying the Oval Office.

"So in order to “back-down” an imploding, legless Soviet system that Gorbachev was scrambling to reform, Reagan had to oversee a record deficit? Jeez, even democrats don’t dislike Reagan as much as you do. "

Right, it was all just a huge coincidence that the Soviet Empire imploded soon after Reagan's two terms.

"As I say, one hell of a mess the guy you elected twice left. "

The War in Iraq was basically won, and Obama just had to avoid screwing that up (and thankfully he appears to have avoided screwing it up). Afghanistan is Afghanistan -- not a place you would choose to fight, but we didn't have a choice. Obama hasn't come up with some magical solution, and basically is doing the same thing Bush did, except for the huge increase in Predator attacks.
3.15.2011 | 10:11am
"Argue about the past all you like, the ship is sinking and, unfortunately, President Obama is at the helm. "

This is really what it comes down to. Pointing fingers and assigning blame for how we got here is useless.

The current system is unsustainable, and it is immoral to allow it to continue and expect our children and grandchildren to deal with it.

We can't tax our way out of this or expect economic growth to solve the problem. Tough decisions are going to have to be made and both politicians and their constituents are going to have to behave like grown-ups. I am not optimistic.
3.15.2011 | 11:07am
Rob G says:
Bop and Henry James err in equating the policies of the GOP with conservatism, as if all they know about the latter is what they hear from GOP shills like Hannity and Limbaugh. They seem quite unfamiliar with the lines of conservatism that are critical of corporate capitalism, unrestrained individualism, consumerism, etc. There were many on the Right that found W's conservatism suspect in one way or another, the author of this piece, David Mills, being one of them, if I may be so bold to say so. The fact that Bop and HJ didn't hear them on Fox doesn't mean that they didn't exist.
3.15.2011 | 12:52pm
Artaban says:
Bop--I have to agree with what other commentators have been saying...There are holes in your arguments I could drive a bus through.

A lot of good has been done in Afghanistan, and even Obama realizes the battle must continue to be fought. The Taliban had to go. They were killing women who sought to educate themselves or to vote. They publicly executed homosexuals.

Did you not see the videos of people dancing in the streets when we drove those murderers from the cities?!

And now al Qaeda and the Taliban are seeking political power in Pakistan...a country with nukes. It doesn't take a genius to guess what will happen should they gain even a minority position of power in that country.

Wake up. If you live in New York City or L.A., and they gain the power they are seeking, you might not have anything to wake up to...
3.15.2011 | 2:53pm
Joe Long says:
"Intergenerational justice" would imply leaving future generations a society in better moral shape than we found it, treading as lightly on the social as on the physical environment, and protecting the family as fanatically as any endangered species. Government programs which subvert and replace the family have been wasting more important resources than mere money, for generations.

"Intergenerational justice" would also include the physical protection of our nation - I would rather my grandchildren inherit effective carrier battlegroups for emergencies, than government subsidies for daily living, even if the two options weren't separated by an order of magnitude when it comes to cost (the carrier battlegroup being far, far cheaper).
3.16.2011 | 10:17am
Henry James says:
Bob:

Nice summary of "philodoxy." And one useful method to combat it.

But in the present case? When some readers are fair enough to explicitly eschew ideology and party affiliation?
3.16.2011 | 2:50pm
When I went to the bank yesterday, to cash a cheque for US1000, the bank only gave me $952 Canadian dollars.

There was a time they would have given me $1250 Canadian gladly. Not now.

Do the US "social justice" people understand what that means?

It means you don't have the money to do justice.
3.17.2011 | 1:57pm
JB says:
Joe Long on 3/15 speaks the most rational truth on this feed. AMEN to you.
4.12.2011 | 1:22pm
Kulig Dog says:
"Intergenerational justice" would imply leaving future generations a society in better moral shape than we found it, treading as lightly on the social as on the physical environment, and protecting the family as fanatically as any endangered species. Government programs which subvert and replace the family have been wasting more important resources than mere money, for generations. The Center for Public Justice is not part of the evangelical left. The document notes that it is a bipartisan agreement and should be understood in that context. I say more about there here: http://www.thinkingevangelical.com/2011/03/call-for-intergenerational-justice.html
5.27.2011 | 1:58pm
So in order to back-down an imploding, legless Soviet system that Gorbachev was scrambling to reform, Reagan had to oversee a record deficit? Jeez, even democrats dont dislike Reagan as much as you do. But with that said, I do think this was a (small) step in the right direction. The point about many people's, "materialistic, live-for-the-moment mentality" is nudging toward the core problem. After all, if voters weren't so intent on electing candidates who magically promised to concurrently increase funding for government programs while decreasing taxes, we might not have this problem...
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