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Michael Kinsley’s Confusion

Michael Kinsley’s recent Bloomberg View column, which appeared in the Philadelphia Inquirer as “Bishops are not exactly oppressed” (Nov. 23), makes a number of basic mistakes concerning law as it relates to religious freedom that we, as lawyers and law professors, wish to correct.

Kinsley begins by usefully calling attention to the recent warnings by Archbishop Timothy Dolan of New York and Archbishop Charles Chaput of Philadelphia that there is a drive by some to marginalize religion. Honest observers can no longer blink what Dolan, Chaput, and other religious voices have warned against for years: our law and culture are increasingly hostile to the possibility of living out one’s faith. Civil authority is finding more and more excuses to interfere in the life of believing communities.

As Archbishop Chaput recently observed, in a speech from which Kinsley quotes: “In the years ahead, . . .we’ll . . . also see less and less unchallenged space for religious institutions to carry out their work in the public square. It’s already happening with state pressure on Catholic hospitals and adoption agencies, in lawsuits attacking the scope of religious liberty, federal restrictions on conscience protections, attacks on charitable tax deductions and religious tax-exempt status, and interference in the hiring practices of organizations like Catholic Charities.” There is less religious liberty today, not more. There is no honestly denying it. The alternatives are to ignore it or to justify it. Kinsley tries to do both.

Kinsley’s first move is to counsel, “Don’t worry.” The presence of six Catholic Justices on the United States Supreme Court, he suggests, will surely guarantee the rights of Catholics and others to religious freedom. Catholics are not so crafty and lawless as Kinsley suggests, however. In a 1990 case, Employment Division v. Smith, the Supreme Court, in a majority opinion written by Justice Antonin Scalia, an ardent Catholic, held that the Court had little or no jurisdiction to create First Amendment-based exemptions to neutral laws of general applicability that might in practice burden or bar religious practice. In sum, our Constitution as currently interpreted leaves it almost entirely to the political process—to Congress and state legislatures—to determine the scope of religious liberty, and legislatures are increasingly stingy when it comes to freedom of religion. Kinsley’s first error of law, then, amounts to the demonstrably false claim that Catholics on the Supreme Court will be reliable judicial activists on behalf of religious liberty.

Kinsley’s second error is more subtle and insidious. Kinsley writes that the “spheres [of church and state] aren’t separate and needn’t be.” From this it follows, according to Kinsley, that “the church, like any citizen or institution,” has a right to take positions on law and politics, and use its persuasive power to influence public officials and the electorate as vigorously as possible. And from this it follows finally, according to Kinsley, that when the Church fails to persuade, “the Church cannot then complain”—it had its chance, and failed.

The error in this is the idea that laws are valid, indeed beyond reproach, when they emerge from democratic processes and a marketplace of ideas. But everyone’s having had a “voice” in lawmaking does not guarantee good law. Majorities sometimes make laws that deny basic and important freedoms, and American history is replete with examples of this point.

What Kinsley refers to as the Church’s “complaining” is, more realistically, the Church’s contemporary witness to the widening failure, including on the part of the U.S. Supreme Court, to require or even allow law to be based on adequate moral reasoning and respect for religious views. Kinsley closes with a rhetorical ploy that reveals his hand: “One of the social developments that the bishops are most upset about is gay marriage. . . . on gay marriage, the church could have gone either way.” Those who understand the Christian moral tradition won’t have so easy a time of it as Kinsley does.

But Kinsley does have something of an unfortunate legal anchor here. As long as our fundamental enacted law confers a constitutionally enforceable right to a revisable and plastic self and a constitutionally permitted marginalization of religion, Catholics and others will have good ground to call for better law. And so they will. What Pope Benedict XVI said to a group of American bishops in Rome recently establishes that the issue is not complaining bishops, it is the Catholic witness: “The seriousness of the challenges which the Church in America, under your leadership, is called to confront in the near future cannot be underestimated. The obstacles to Christian faith and practice raised by a secularized culture also affect believers.” The issue is, instead, the witness of Catholics and other Christians to a culture whose laws increasingly threaten the possibility of religious belief.

Patrick McKinley Brennan is the Associate Dean and John F. Scarpa Chair in Catholic Legal Studies and Michael P. Moreland is Associate Professor of Law at the Villanova University School of Law.

RESOURCES


Michael Kinsley, Bishops are not exactly oppressed

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Comments:

12.1.2011 | 12:58pm
Now this is one doozy of a subordinate conjunction:

"As long as our fundamental enacted law confers a constitutionally enforceable right to a revisable and plastic self and a constitutionally permitted marginalization of religion..."

Good article though.

:)
12.1.2011 | 1:05pm
Richard says:
I'll side with Kinsley here. The aggressiveness and relentless victimhood of the Catholic bishops in the public sphere is mostly related to an attempt to divert attention from the colossal blunders of the church institution in recent decades. Sure the culture has deteriorated significantly in recent decades. That doesn't change the Church's primary role of winning souls person by person, not by legislating what the bishops teach is moral right and wrong. And because the Church has been losing that battle, the bishops are trying to force their issue instead of focusing on the really hard work.
12.1.2011 | 1:51pm
James W. says:
But, on the other hand?

To this very day the Catholic Church itself asserts its rights to pass anti-abortion laws, based on its religious beliefs; imposing them on everyone. Even when those are not 1) the legal - 2) or even the religious - beliefs of most Protestants. Thus the Church would force its religious beliefs, on others.

This may be why we are now seeing a slight compensatory antagonism. Churches in the past often imposed their religious beliefs on one state after another; and many are clearly still trying to do it today. Hence? A slightly exaggerated counter-response. In the name of? Freedom of Religion, after all.
12.1.2011 | 2:05pm
We Catholics need to stop accepting the false history of the First Amendment that liberals propagate. Supposedly, the atheistic (or at best, deist) founding fathers wanted to minimize church influence on the state. The reality though is that the church had had no influence on the state since Henry VIII had accomplished his hostile takeover of the Church in 1533. The English Kings and Aristocracy thereafter ran the established church (or in the colonies, established churches) as their personal cat's paws.

Then it is also said that the founding fathers wanted no establishments of religion in America for liberty reasons. Again: false. The reality is that because of the complex history of intra-Protestant conflict in Britain from 1547-1717, the powers that be in America had set up their established religions on a state (or earlier, colony) basis, AND THEY DID NOT WANT CONGRESS MAKING ANY INCONSISTENT LAWS "RESPECTING AN ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION." That is all the Establishment clause really stood for.

Here is the truth about establishments in America. Royal colonies generally had established the Anglican Church (i.e., Virginia), while entrepreneurial colonies like Massachusetts and the other New England colonies had Puritan establishments. The one originally Catholic colony, Maryland, also had an Anglican establishment as a result of the intercolonial war Virginia waged on Maryland in 1688 at the time England overthrew the last Catholic king of England, James II. When the Constitution came along to bound the individual colonies together more closely, the "framers" wanted to retain the freedom to set up their own state-wide establishments without interference from the newly formed congress of the 13 states' representatives.

Meanwhile during the 18th Century, a Great Awakening had occurred which weakened the grip of the Anglican Church in the royal colonies. As a result, once the King got thrown out, the King's Church got thrown out of those colonies where it was established. That, though, did not change the fact that several New England colony-states still had Congregational religious establishments that they were content to continue. Those establishments were not impacted by the first Amendment.

That is how things likely would have stayed in America but for the arrival of large numbers of Irish Catholic immigrants in the 1830s. Because of Protestant hatred of Catholicism, all the cozy arrangements among protestant sects (which usually included state support for all Protestant denominations' schools in a particular state) had to be revised. That led not just to riots against Catholic targets and the infamous Maria Monk stories, but also to the Public School movement and later in the Century to the Blaine Amendments passed in most states designed to prevent any state aid to Catholic schools ever.

When the Supreme Court started to get involved in questions concerning aid to Catholic schools in the 1940s, that notorious anti-Catholic and KKK member, Hugo Black, came up with new fabrications about what the First Amendment means that have now become gospel for the liberals and other anti-Catholics. As a result, the wonderful Catholic school system that was educating about 10% of the US school population in the 1950s is now close to closing. How can anybody compete against the Public School Monopoly that can tax the patrons of competitor schools to make sure they don't have the money to contribute to their chosen schools?

Moral? History tells us the truth, not Supreme Court opinions written 150 years after the events in question.
12.1.2011 | 2:16pm
Ray Ingles says:
"In sum, our Constitution as currently interpreted leaves it almost entirely to the political process—to Congress and state legislatures—to determine the scope of religious liberty, and legislatures are increasingly stingy when it comes to freedom of religion."

Is that interpretation wrong?
12.1.2011 | 2:47pm
James W writes:

"To this very day the Catholic Church itself asserts its rights to pass anti-abortion laws, based on its religious beliefs; imposing them on everyone. Even when those are not 1) the legal - 2) or even the religious - beliefs of most Protestants. Thus the Church would force its religious beliefs, on others. "

Bizarre. Now where does the Catholic Church "pass anti-abortion laws"? In the Church Congress that secretly makes law for Americans and enforces it through some secret Police Force? Actually, there are only two legislatures (+ a number of civil courts) that can pass laws affecting abortion anywhere in the states: the Congress and the State Legislature. The Catholic Church should have the same right to ask those legislatures to pass moral laws as any other person. No one would question the right of Martin Luther King, Jr. to ask the US Congress to pass moral laws regarding blacks. Likewise, the Church should be free to stand up for moral positions to protect the least brethren, those children in their mothers' wombs that the mothers want to kill.

As to the fact that some Protestants would allow mothers to kill their children: they should stand up and say so and not hide behind a fraudulent doctrine of separation of church and state which is used primarily when someone stands up for an uncomfortable truth. Laws should be framed in the daylight of real debate. Protestants who would abandon Christ's teachings in favor of moral laxity should admit that uncomfortable reality and fess up to their utter lack of regard for Christian moral teaching.
12.1.2011 | 2:59pm
Ray Ingles asks if the Constitution leaves it up to Congress and the state legislatures to determine the scope of religious liberty.

ANSWER: NO. The First Amendment provides unequivocally: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...." Per Fourteenth Amendment jurisprudence, the Free Exercise provision has been found to apply to the states as well, since the Fourteenth Amendment's passage in 1868 (or really since the 1940-50s interpretations of the effect of the 14th Amendment on states). Neither Congress nor the states can prohibit the free exercise of religion whether they want to be stingy or not.
12.1.2011 | 3:11pm
The bishops are not wrong to cmplain about the status quo of "public education" where parents are forced to send their kids to the state run, union dominated public schools that mandate secular neutrality. In Newark, New Jersey, it costs the taxpayer nearly thirty grand to educate a child at some of the failing public high schools. Saint Benedicts Prep (who routinely graduates their African American students to America's top colleges and universities) costs roughly eight thousand per year. Thank God for the wise judges who prevent desperate inner city parents from sending their kids to Saint Benedicts on the taxpayers dime, where they would be taught that the earth is flat. What a sick joke the public education racket is.
12.1.2011 | 3:26pm
It is far too easy to create, pass and sign laws that cause undue hardship for those affected by them. Pick up just about any newspaper. Bad laws are being passed much too often taking away individual rights, whether it be local, state or national government bodies. It can take many years in the court system and very expensive legal representation to undo what one self serving politician signed into law with the sweep of a pen. This is what has been happening to our religious liberties. At times, it seems a losing battle to take a stand for what is morally right. I watched what happened to the Veterans of the Cross with their memorial cross in the Mojave Desert since 1934. When they finally won their long drawn out hard-fought legal battle, an unidentified park employee stole their cross in the middle of the night, and the national park authorities refused to allow another memorial cross to be put up in its place. Their memorials are being attacked around the country and it is a disgrace. Ever since I have made donations to this organization because of their faith and willingness to stand up for our religious liberties. We need more like them.
12.1.2011 | 4:25pm
James W. says:
To this very day the Catholic Church itself asserts its rights to pass anti-abortion laws, based on its religious beliefs; imposing them on everyone. Even when those are not 1) the legal - 2) or even the religious - beliefs of most Protestants. Thus the Church would force its religious beliefs, on others.

patrick
Now where does the Catholic Church "pass anti-abortion laws"? In the Church Congress that secretly makes law for Americans and enforces it through some secret Police Force?

Enforcement falls to the secret society of albino assassin-monks. Everyone knows that.

Now, of course the "belief" in question was nothing more than the common belief of Western Civilization and is one of the markers that distinguished it from Classical and non-Western Civilizations. The belief that killing babies was just plain wrong was unquestioned until fairly recently. In fact, one can find anti-abortion statements from Ted Kennedy and Jessie Jackson from back before it became politically mandatory. (And a glance at the abortion statistics may reveal the essential correctness of Jesse Jackson's assessment back then.)

The one thing that never seems to occur to anyone in this post-Modern Age is that the wrongness of killing babies is not a "belief" at all, but a simple consequence to the natural right to life possessed by all living organisms. But ever since the Triumph of the Will, nothing must interfere with the consequence-free satisfaction of the untrammeled appetites. Should it surprise anyone that the obesity problem, anorexia, and bulemia are also common afflictions today?

James W. says:
Churches in the past often imposed their religious beliefs on one state after another

I would recommend we re-institute the study of history in our schools, save only that that too would be politicized. Perhaps it would be simpler merely to ask for a list of state after state in which churches imposed their beliefs. (As opposed to states which imposed churches on their subjects.)
12.1.2011 | 4:28pm
CKG says:
@James W -

Leaving aside the ridiculous statement that "the Catholic Church asserts its rights to pass. . . laws", do you think the day won't come (if it isn't already here) when the secularist ruling class comes after Protestants, even pro-abortion ones, for whatever reasons suit their purposes at the time?
12.1.2011 | 5:00pm
bobster says:
Richard, Catholics do not argue for laws restricting abortion by citing the Catechism. The argument is that an embryo is a human in every sense and is made rationally and logically. Every citizen has the right to make such arguments.
Ray Ingles, of course the answer to your question is no. A moments thought will tell you that the purpose of the First Amendment is to keep legislatures from those decisions. That is the point of enumerated rights in the Constitution.
12.1.2011 | 7:53pm
@patricksarsfield: I know that's the text of the First Amendment and that the First Amendment has been incorporated against the states, but we're making the different and merely descriptive point that (1) the post-Smith interpretation of the Free Exercise Clause holds that there is, generally speaking, no constitutional right to a religious exemption from a neutral law of general applicability, and (2) creation of such exemptions (including on a wholesale basis, as in the federal and state RFRAs) is a matter of legislative discretion.
12.1.2011 | 8:20pm
"The error in this is the idea that laws are valid, indeed beyond reproach, when they emerge from democratic processes and a marketplace of ideas. But everyone’s having had a “voice” in lawmaking does not guarantee good law. Majorities sometimes make laws that deny basic and important freedoms, and American history is replete with examples of this point."

I agree with this point, but I also see a certain amount of irony in it. The church's opposition to same-sex marriage is seen by many as exactly this kind of denial of a "basic and important freedom", even when enacted by democratic processes.

There is much that is in the eye of the beholder.

Having said that, I do believe that the First Amendment should offer protection for those who are religiously opposed as a matter of conscience to performing certain acts. Catholic hospitals should not be compelled to provide abortion services, etc. There is a difference between compelling someone to act contrary to their own conscience and protecting the freedom of others act on theirs.
12.1.2011 | 9:29pm
p. henderson says:
I think it's wrong to regard passing an abortion law as imposing religious belief. Many different religions condemn abortion as do some atheist humanists such as Nat Hentoff. Also, abortion could be regarded as cruelty to animals by those who are unwilling to grant the fetus humanity. Evidence suggests the fetus is capable of suffering. Religion is certainly a source of moral opinion and there is no legal basis for insisting that moral opinions be predicated only on atheist premises. At bottom a religion is a set of metaphysical and moral beliefs. Why is it okay to impose beliefs grounded in psychology and evolutionary theory and not beliefs grounded in theology? The view that science can answer ethical questions runs up against Hume's ought-is challenge: Science tells us what is but what ought to be is not a question that science can answer. But even if science did have all the answers we would be free as citizens to derive our opinions from sources of our own choosing.
12.1.2011 | 11:35pm
And, after taking the time to read Kinsley's article, I have to agree with his basic point. Christians are hardly "oppressed" in any real sense of the word.

Our society provides vast protections for religious views and practice, but it does draw the line somewhere. Every religion has "practices" that are abusive or against the law. Female genital mutilation, physical discipline of children that rises to the level of abuse, and illegal drug use are only some examples. How about stoning for adultery? Some religious views encourage it.

So there are always going to be limits to the kind and variety of religious views and practices that will be allowed in a society. And that includes practices and views held by some Christians. While I am basically skeptical of laws that restrict any religious activity, there are cases where they are legitimate, no?

And in our great American society you will be hard-pressed to find any group that is more free to express its religious views, or structure its own life, than the Christian community.
12.2.2011 | 12:54am
M. Moreland writes:

"@patricksarsfield: I know that's the text of the First Amendment and that the First Amendment has been incorporated against the states, but we're making the different and merely descriptive point that (1) the post-Smith interpretation of the Free Exercise Clause holds that there is, generally speaking, no constitutional right to a religious exemption from a neutral law of general applicability, and (2) creation of such exemptions (including on a wholesale basis, as in the federal and state RFRAs) is a matter of legislative discretion."

First: Who is we?

As to the current state of the Free Exercise decisional law, your statement of it is unobjectionable. However, "neutral laws of general applicability" are in the at times jaundiced eyes of the beholders. Case in point: the 2009 McDonald-Lawlor bill in Connecticut which was phrased neutrally but designed in truth to control the Catholic Church specifically.
12.2.2011 | 3:09am
Rick says:
"It’s already happening with...attacks on charitable tax deductions and religious tax-exempt status..."

There was a time recently when I could have enthusiastically joined in "attacks on religious tax-exempt status." It was when I learned the the IRS had been persuaded to grant Scientology, that satanic, money-making scam, tax-exempt status as a religion. In a more sane country like Germany, the government has declared Scientology to be not a religion, but rather a fraud and an abusive business enterprise. The French government has declared it to be a "totalitarian cult". Meanwhile, our government has criticized the French and German governments for denying Scientologists their religious freedom and rights.

Are you sure it's the US government that is relentlessly secular and hostile to religious liberties?
12.2.2011 | 4:20am
Michael PS says:
It is one thing for the Church to claim to be mistress in her own house; quite another to claim to be judge in her own cause.

The quarrel is an old one: Guelph and Ghibelline, Gallican and Ultramontane, the party labels change, but the principle in dispute is the same.

As Rousseau says, ““Each man alienates, I admit, by the social compact, only such part of his powers, goods and liberty as it is important for the community to control; but it must also be granted that the Sovereign is sole judge of what is important,” for “ if the individuals retained certain rights, as there would be no common superior to decide between them and the public, each, being on one point his own judge, would ask to be so on all; the state of nature would thus continue, and the association would necessarily become inoperative or tyrannical.”
12.2.2011 | 10:56am
Luke Blanda says:
The authors of this piece have made their points quite clearly. Whoever reads the ensuing comments to see if they pass muster ought to exercise greater
control. The discussion that this article has generated is too technical and
frankly boring. In fact, I simply stopped reading . . . . It was too much like attending a cocktail party in a room full of lawyers. The points that the authors have made are not that difficult, not that complicated. Beware Jarndyce v. Jarndyce!
12.2.2011 | 12:23pm
AKO says:
"The error in this is the idea that laws are valid, indeed beyond reproach, when they emerge from democratic processes and a marketplace of ideas. But everyone’s having had a “voice” in lawmaking does not guarantee good law. Majorities sometimes make laws that deny basic and important freedoms, and American history is replete with examples of this point."

I also agree with this point. It is indeed ironic that the church's opposition to same-sex marriage takes away the basic human freedoms we have all come to love. As I have said before, what's the difference between stopping two people who have the same eye color from marrying and having to people of the same sex marrying, we are all still people.
12.2.2011 | 12:49pm
@Michael PS

What you quote is one reason the US never adopted France's skewed ideas of "revolution", or the resulting theories of fascism and communism.

You can do better. There are many quotes from the AMERICAN founding fathers concerning the danger of abrogation of individual rights, not to mention the benefit of a religiously observant (i.e., civilized) society.
12.2.2011 | 12:55pm
Artaban7 says:
Rick,

It hardly follows logic that because one particular religion/cult/faith is not discriminated against, therefore a country is not "relentlessly secular and hostile to religious liberties".

I do, however agree that France is hostile to religious liberty. You can't wear anything even benignly religious in French public schools--no crosses, no veils/hijabs. Don't know enough about Germany to make a judgment.
12.2.2011 | 2:20pm
Charles says:
Please pray for Kinsey. The following paragraph towards the end of his column reveals the hopelessness and unworthiness, and its resulting defense in intentional dishonesty and materialism, we've all been through during various crises of faith. He feels cheated and can not appreciate the great graces that come by striving to do God's will.

"What kind of game is God playing here? He’s told four people to run for president, but (barring a miracle, I guess) at least three of them are going to end up disappointed. Imagine the situation: God himself has told you to run for president. Did he tell you that you’d win? Possibly not, but he strongly implied it. Why else would he want you to run? What an endorsement. What a boon to your fundraising. And what a downer when he fails to deliver."
12.2.2011 | 6:56pm
Rick says:
@Artaban7:

If our government is willing to criticize our own allies for failing to grant full religious liberties and privileges to any and all religious groups, including even the lunatic cults, then it is at least strong evidence that it is unreasonable to caricature our government as "hostile" to religion. It is an entirely logical conclusion.

Every religion or minority group will tend to see its own treatment as unfair. A few years ago, I had a conversation with a Baha'i leader in California. He was actually the chief of the federal court system for the Western US...a highly educated and rational man. And yet he told me that Baha'is were discriminated against by the Christian establishment in this country. Christianity so dominated the government and legal system that, he claimed, Baha'is were girding themselves for an imminent wave of persecutions rivaling those they had undergone in Iran after the Islamic revolution. I was almost speechless, but finally managed to say that California seemed to be a hothouse for every imaginable religious sect or cult and that a campaign of government-led persecution against peaceful Baha'is seemed extraordinarily improbable. Yet he insisted that it was coming. We are still waiting for the great anti-Baha'i pogrom! It is perfectly understandable, therefore, that Catholics, like all minority groups, will magnify anti-Catholic bigotry in their minds.

Another worthwhile point to consider is that most of the governmental impact we experience comes from our local governments, rather than from Washington. How much anti-religious legislation or propaganda has come from your local government? We aren't seeing any here. In fact, when a teenager living on our block followed my younger son home from school and attacked and beat him up, the judge sentenced him not to a reformatory but to a year of involuntary participation in a church youth group!
12.2.2011 | 11:10pm
Nancy D. says:
It is important to note that our Founding Fathers signed The Declaration of Independence that states that from the moment of our creation, our Unalienable Rights have been endowed to us from our Creator, Nature's God, with the capital G, NOT nature's gods, and thus we can assume the purpose of our unalienable Rights is what God intended. It is that difference that makes all the difference.
12.4.2011 | 1:31am
Ken says:
While I am basically skeptical of laws that restrict any religious activity...

Except that the discussion, in concrete terms, isn't about restriction, but an invasion that will force Christian communities to engage in the murder of unborn children either directly, as in Catholic hospitals, or through taxation and required insurance premiums.

''Mistress in her own house''? The problem is that the barbarians currently in power have invaded our house and demanded not just our money, but our souls.

This purple prose is to make a point : we are not talking about the Church taking over the government, but a direct frontal assault on our common humanity.
12.4.2011 | 8:05am
Michael PS says:
Artaban7 wrote

“I do, however agree that France is hostile to religious liberty. You can't wear anything even benignly religious in French public schools--no crosses, no veils/hijabs”

In what sense is this “hostile to religious liberty”? Freedom of religion is recognized and protected by the law requiring the public schools to close for a half-day every week, to allow children to receive religious instruction, if that is their parents’ wish and by the state paying the salaries of teachers and librarians (but not principals or other staff) in independent schools (including faith schools), that prepare their pupils for the public examinations, for the duty of the state to provide public instruction is a universal one.

Your view reflects two errors: On the one hand, the lay character of state schools is not restricted, in the case of pupils, to respect for their freedom of conscience (although it certainly includes this): it essentially consists in excluding religion from state schools and it therefore imposes a duty of restraint on pupils in their behaviour, since they find themselves in a place pertaining to the public sphere of the state and its administration. On the other hand, pupils’ freedom of conscience, which is an internal freedom, does not give them the right to express and manifest their religious beliefs in educational institutions, for that involves external acts which improperly introduce religion into the public sphere of the state.

Of course, the "public sphere" of the state is not to to be confused with the domain of civil society, where everyone is free to express and manifest their religious beliefs
12.6.2011 | 3:01pm
Artaban7 says:
"Your view reflects two errors: On the one hand, the lay character of state schools is not restricted, in the case of pupils, to respect for their freedom of conscience (although it certainly includes this): it essentially consists in excluding religion from state schools and it therefore imposes a duty of restraint on pupils in their behaviour, since they find themselves in a place pertaining to the public sphere of the state and its administration. On the other hand, pupils’ freedom of conscience, which is an internal freedom, does not give them the right to express and manifest their religious beliefs in educational institutions, for that involves external acts which improperly introduce religion into the public sphere of the state."--Michael PS

Oh, I understand now. So long as one's religion is not expressed through "external acts", it's okay. Michael, that's absolutely ridiculous. A belief that is not lived is no belief at all. That's how beliefs die out--through being restricted only to the realm of "internal freedom", and the evidence in France bears that out. Church attendance is, according to some polls, a mere 3%. If you don't think shackling the expression of religion in the "public sphere" has something to do with that, you've never had adequate sociological or psychological instruction.

As for the claim that the "public sphere of the state" is allegedly different from "the domain of civil society"...such does not follow in regard to public education. The proper role of the school is preparation of citizens FOR civil society. Any school that thinks it can ignore religion, when some 90% of the world's populace identify themselves as such has failed in its task of education.

That awareness is precisely why a growing number of public school systems in America have mandatory courses on "World Religions" or "Christianity". That's why private Catholic schools have had compulsory "World Religions" courses for decades. One can't be an effective citizen of the world without such fundamental knowledge.
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